And while the stock market can return higher returns, they also have higher risk. The risk is usually reflected in the return.

I don’t invest in the Stock Market either. Personally, I find the idea of someone investing in a company they know nothing about to be insane (note I do know some people get rich in the stock market. They are rare). You want your money to grow, buy precious metals. No one ever went broke stockpiling gold.

There is a reason there is a 10% hicky on taking money out of your retirement fund early. The gov doesn’t like the fact you are using it for something other than their uses. Whenever the gov reduces interest rates, the dollar inflates. They would much prefer to have your money wrapped up in their fiat money system than in something that holds its value.

The FRN is the greatest scam ever perpetrated on the American people. They steal your money, out of your pocket, and all they have to do is sneeze during a Fed meeting.

Sure, you have to pay your taxes on the money you don’t put into a retirement fund, but you don’t have your money locked up for the next 30 years, deflating at 10% a year. You are paying a tax on it whether it sits there or not. Why not do something to hold its value a little better?

Take your money, buy gold (you can get it in fairly small trade bars), put it in a safe deposit box if you want, whatever, and in 10 more years see what it is worth next to that $500 you have in the 401k.

Heh heh heh! Are you shitting me?

Nope. You would be surprised how much you can buy when you don’t donate to the gov’s 401k.

I’ll bet you’ve got rifles

yep.

and a year’s worth of canned tuna fish

nope.

Where do you keep all that gold, in the WC of your toilet?

Right next to my rifles.

>>Not really. I can choose not to
>>buy insurance.

Yeah, you can (in some states). Depends on how stupid you are. Or if you can afford $500,000 for a liver transplant or a heart-lung transplant, then go for it.

But it would be MY choice.

>>You are going to see way more than that if
>>you think printing more money is going to
>>solve the problem.

Talk about yer non sequitur. Where did “printing more money” come from?

Where do you think they get the money for the bailouts? Now you know why I said, “Get a clue.”

As a SOCIETY it is in the countries best interest to have a healthy and financially stable population.
I agree. However, gov programs are not how you achieve that.

Oh ??? So what “private” company has entered the Social Security field?

How many “private” companies have mismanaged their retirement funds?

And while the stock market can return higher returns, they also have higher risk. The risk is usually reflected in the return.

>> Which is why I buy gold now instead of 401k.

Heh heh heh! Are you shitting me? I’ll bet you’ve got rifles and a year’s worth of canned tuna fish buried in your back yard! Where do you keep all that gold, in the WC of your toilet?

HAW!

>>Not really. I can choose not to
>>buy insurance.

Yeah, you can (in some states). Depends on how stupid you are. Or if you can afford $500,000 for a liver transplant or a heart-lung transplant, then go for it.

>>You are going to see way more than that if
>>you think printing more money is going to
>>solve the problem.

Talk about yer non sequitur. Where did “printing more money” come from?

Not really. I can choose not to buy insurance. I can’t choose to not pay taxes without SWAT busting down my door. That is the definition of slavery — forced labor at the point of a gun.

In any case, one way or another, you’re going to pay. If 75,000,000 baby boomers are out on the street with no homes and no food, there’s going to be a bailout. Trust me. And that will cost you a f&ck of a lot more than putting money into SS and then getting it back after you retire.

Which is why I buy gold now instead of 401k. Let the dollar sink all it wants. My money is safe from the gov.

#16, Yep.

#17, If you want to be a slave then shut the eff up !!! Slaves aren’t allowed to speak.

You misunderstood. I am not a slave. You are the slave happy to take what the slave owners leave for you. “From each his capabilities, to each his needs.” Sound familiar?

As a SOCIETY it is in the countries best interest to have a healthy and financially stable population.

I agree. However, gov programs are not how you achieve that.

#18, However, much as you might like to see millions and millions of less-fortunate people starving to death under the interstate overpasses all around the country, that ain’t gonna happen.

You are going to see way more than that if you think printing more money is going to solve the problem.

Has it not occurred to people that the reason we have a larger percentage of poor people is not because of lack of social services but because of too many of them?

Why should these poor folk work when they have you to support them?

Why should they save when you are doing it for them?

Get a clue.

>>And if someone fails to save for their own
>>retirement, they should starve to death
>>unless they can get their family or some
>>charitable organization to help them.

That’s a mighty heartwarming sentiment, Little.

However, much as you might like to see millions and millions of less-fortunate people starving to death under the interstate overpasses all around the country, that ain’t gonna happen.

When a small number of hobos and winos are starving to death, that can just be swept under the carpet as though it didn’t exist.

If published statistics on US savings are accurate, by the time the baby boom shit really hits the fan, there’s going to be a large percentage of the 80,000,000+ baby boomers without a pot to piss in. And letting THEM starve to death isn’t a viable option.

Hey, if Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae can’t manage their own business, let ‘em crumble. Right? That didn’t happen.

And if we 86 SS, that’s going to lead to chaos that will take an infusion of capital to solve that is MUCH greater than what you’re paying into SS now.

Why make me a slave to those who aren’t smart enough to manage their own money?

If you want to be a slave then shut the eff up !!! Slaves aren’t allowed to speak.

This ponzi scheme is just one example of where we need regulations in our society. Thieves are out there. Privately run schemes will never have the protections of the government. Even when they are protected to some degree, they are susceptible to the vagaries of the market place. Yes, there is the oft repeated example of Enron. Well, just take a look at Fannie May and Freddie Mac. Their stock has tanked too and might go belly up without capital infusion. How much has Ford stock dropped over the past 7 ½ years?

As a SOCIETY it is in the countries best interest to have a healthy and financially stable population. That is how taxes are paid and services rendered for ALL of us. That is how our military is supported. That is how the best brains get educated. That is how the roads get built. That is how police, fire, and infrastructure maintenance function. We do all of that and much much more as a society.

So no, not everyone is an expert at everything, including you. We still rely upon society to provide services in many areas because it is a function of society to co-operate and it is cost effective. No town, let alone a city, could operate without an effective sewer system and garbage collection. To operate an effective sewer system requires a steady tax base. That requires a steady, stable population with enough income to contribute to paying for not only this, but all services. SSA is just one part of the whole of society.

I support Ron Paul’s economic plan. Get rid of the Fed, go back to the gold standard, and get the gummint out of our lives totally.

And if someone fails to save for their own retirement, they should starve to death unless they can get their family or some charitable organization to help them.

Taking money from those who earn it and giving it to those who don’t is theft, pure and simple.

Why make you a slave to people who aren’t smart enough not to get cancer or heart disease or diabetes, when you don’t have it yourself? That’s what you’re doing with a pooled-risk insurance program.

In any case, one way or another, you’re going to pay. If 75,000,000 baby boomers are out on the street with no homes and no food, there’s going to be a bailout. Trust me. And that will cost you a f&ck of a lot more than putting money into SS and then getting it back after you retire.

This whole “privatization” scam is nothing more than a PONZI SCHEME by Bush’s neocon puppeteers to take money away from people who need it, and give it to those who don’t.

Yes. Unless, of course, charitable individuals want to donate some of their 401k (which they aren’t paying any taxes on) to help them out.

Why make me a slave to those who aren’t smart enough to manage their own money?

Assuming that the IOUs are paid back, the surplus will be spent in a few years. Then SS can’t pay 100% of what it promised. So either it will need to get more money (higher taxes), or lower benefits.

The double whammy is that the IOUs are paid back from future tax revenue. So not only will there be no money for the Feds to borrow, but they will have to start paying back what they borrowed in the first place.

Well, yeah, it IS in a special marked account. It’s just not immune from dickwads like Dumbya tapping into it to pay for his trophy war.

And sure the ROI from the stock market is better than that from SS. That’s why I invest in the stock market. Of course, I don’t use Dumbya’s barracuda stockbroker parasites for my trade. If they were just going to put the money in no-load index fund or something, I might have supported the idea. (Of course, we could do that ourselves). But no. It’s got to be some complicated PONZI SCHEME, where Dumbya’s shills skim and skim and skim, until there’s little-to-nothing left after the paper-shufflers take their cut.

The SS Admin is EXREMELY efficient. Low overhead, nobody getting $100,000,000 golden parachutes, etc.

>>You seem to believe that individuals can’t
>>be trusted with their own money.

We’re not talking about trusting people with their own money (although you’re right, I think a lot of people CAN NOT be trusted with their own money, and what are we going to do when they retire with no safety net…let them starve to death out in the snow?). We’re talking about trusting the money to gummint-appointed financial confidence men. Who are going to mis-manage the funds, take their $100,000,000 golden parachute, and then buy a tropical island and retire. While retirees are eating hamburger helper without the hamburger.

I’d trust Dumbya to plan my financial future about as far as I can throw all the brush he’s cleared from his Crawford “ranch” in the last 8 years.

You want Ponzi schemes, you’re going to have to look somewhere other than SS.