‘Then you won’t be saying “we don’t have a problem with alcohol”.’

You misunderstand what I’m saying when I say ‘we shouldn’t have a problem.’ I don’t mean that alcohol doesn’t cause problems. I mean that we don’t have a problem with it being legal. As in, it’s not dangerous enough to outlaw.

“I never got into the habit of drugs, so I am objective about it.”

I would argue that this makes you NOT objective about it. Otherwise, you’d realize that recreational use of most drugs is not a problem for most people.

Your argument is like saying a priest is good at giving marriage advice.

“When you do drugs, you don’t think there is anything wrong.”

Not hurting anyone else. Check. Enjoying in moderation, so I’m not hurting myself. Check.

Again, you believe that a mere sip of booze or a single toke off a joint causes harm. You’re in the minority. And you’re wrong.

“Its like being in an abusive household.”

Again with the loaded metaphors. It’s nothing like being in an abusive household.

“When you stop being in that culture and step outside. You will see just how much time, energy, money and stress”

Presumptuous.

I don’t hang out with addicts. I’m professionally employed. I spend more money on my cellphone than I do on drugs of any kind, including alcohol. I exercise regularly. I’ve never broken the law. I get along with my family. I’m college educated. I make charitable contributions.

And on and on. I’m also a typical recreational user. You just can’t believe that any upstanding person would ever drink or use drugs. Again, you’re wrong.

“We live in a connected world. What you do affects others. And what others do affects you.”

Why don’t we regulate birthing children, then – you’re all about costs to taxpayers, and one kid ends up costing you more than my drug use.

You might as well argue that no one have any privacy or be allowed to make their own decisions because everything is “connected.”

gag.

‘Wanting to do something “just because I want to” is not a very responsible argument.’

Since when? I *want* to smoke pot. What’s wrong with that? What is the difference between this and wanting to drink a beer? Other than your own personal bias against pot smoking, nothing.

You’ve offered no reason why pot should remain illegal past some insipid argument that, ‘just because we can make it legal doesn’t mean we should.’

What a pathetic argument.

“that means you always wanted to jump off of bridges because everyone else did”

Again, this is a position only a moron would take. Seriously.

This is an argument from someone who can’t find any good reason to support their position. No numbers, no figures, no medical studies, nothing. Just some stupid, incessantly repeated cliche that is really just a sly attempt at lumping all pot smokers together as juveniles.

“You might attend some night and listen to what damage alcohol has done to people’s lives.”

So I have to suffer because less than 1% of the population can’t handle their booze? How does that work?

‘Then you won’t be saying “we don’t have a problem with alcohol”’

People in AA have a problem with alcohol. Just about everyone else doesn’t.

It’s strange to me how many people I’ve met outside the United States who would love to live here and enjoy the American way (the way the founding fathers meant it, the way the constitution is meant to protect it), and they can’t, while in the US so many of its citizens develop a basic mindset that has strayed so far from what made this country great.

Not a vegan and not a former user now cleaned up. Never used.

As for car. No I never went out without a purpose. I make a plan every single morning of what I will do for the day. I start work at 3am most days and end it around 3pm. I do that 6 days a week. I am very very busy and have to schedule time. So to me it is worth money.

I never got into the habit of drugs, so I am objective about it.

When you do drugs, you don’t think there is anything wrong. When you hang around those that do drugs, it reinforces how ok drugs are.

So you wouldn’t know any better if you do them and all your friends do them.

Its like being in an abusive household.

You are living it, you don’t know any better after time. And when you go to a friend’s house and they get into trouble and not get beaten like a dog, you realise. FUCK! I’m in a bad situation.

Its only THEN to you find out what is really going on.

When you stop being in that culture and step outside. You will see just how much time, energy, money and stress you put yourself through to induce an endorphin experience.

You’ll see how much it costs people who don’t even know you in time, energy, money and stress.

As I said. YOU are NOT an Island.

We live in a connected world. What you do affects others. And what others do affects you.

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I hate to break it to you, but… that’s just plum not true.

These guys aren’t going to State Prison, true, but a few months in jail isn’t exactly a picnic either. You only get probation or diversion programs once, maybe twice, depending on the judge. After that they start locking you up unless you start taking the initiative.

Let’s also not forget the idiotic presumption of “possession with intent to distribute”, ie, if you have above a certain amount in weight you are presumed to have wanted to sell it. And the amounts are *not* that great at all.

Wanting to do something “just because I want to” is not a very responsible argument.

First, I don’t smoke tobacco although I did for 30+ years. I don’t smoke pot any more although I did for quite a few years (I really prefer hashish myself). And I might have 3 or 4 oz. of alcohol in a year at social occasions, and I don’t like beer.

Although “curser” made the counter argument much better than I could, I’m just going to throw my two cents back into the pool.

Your argument seems hinged around the fact that “well alcohol is legal and it is a worse drug than pot”. OK, so that means you always wanted to jump off of bridges because everyone else did. So there is a river below, that isn’t as bad as jumping off a bridge over a ravine.

I’m arguing that since we don’t have a problem with alcohol, it follows that, at the least, we shouldn’t have a problem legalizing anything less harmful.

I see you’ve never been to a Twelve Step meeting. Alcoholics Anonymous is the best known. You might attend some night and listen to what damage alcohol has done to people’s lives. Then you won’t be saying “we don’t have a problem with alcohol”.

Most offenders behind bars for drugs are there for large quantities of chemicals, trafficking, or manufacturing. Most possession charges end up being probation or diversion programs.

I think that could be right. In some muslim countries, isn’t theft punishable by chopping off a hand? Now that’s a deterrent, even though I disagree with it. Maybe it keeps the jails less full, I don’t know and I certainly do not want to find out. I think both punishments (for MJ here and theft there) are extreme for the crime.

“Hey, Joey, ever been in a Turkish prison?”

Conservatism requires cognizance of reality…The drug war failed…people want to get high…criminalization ruins American lives.

Some activity is innoculous…outlawing pot use is similar to outlawing teenage love…its stupid and a wrong use of the law…

I do support Jessica’s law however, where adults get 25 years for peodophila. That despicable act takes away the child’s right to a life of liberty, and his pursuit of happiness, as the act affects them their entire life.

The penalty should fit the crime.

Where I grew up in CA it was growing wild all over. Legalizing it won’t do much. The growers won’t go along because they will have to pay taxes that they don’t currently.

Mr. Buckley makes the conservative case against the drug war by evaluating “The practicality of a legal constriction, as for instance, what those states ought to do whose statute books continue to outlaw sodomy, which interdiction is unenforceable, making the law nothing more than print on paper.” He added, “I came to the conclusion that the drug war was not working, and that it would not work absent a change in the structure of the civil rights to which we cling as a valuable part of our patrimony.” We need to calculate the cost to society by outlawing drugs and weigh it against its legalization. -Conservative Case for Drug Legalization: Marijuana
Author: Tom Donelson

Freedom requires freedom to choose…

One thing is clear, many now unemployable because of drug related felonies have had their rights to life, liberty and pursuit to happiness vacated…and intollerable situation from conservative point of view.

Decrimminalization probably requires those drugs known to cause physical harm would require a doctors perscription?

While pot is an easy yes vote, the other drugs may require much deliberation.

“MORE than running the jails”

“Yes caffeine is a drug and should be used in medication preparations as needed to treat illness.”

You’re such a hopeless, out-of-touch idiot. Are you also a vegan?

“Drugs are for fixing problems, not to be used as a toy.”

Says you.

I hope you *always* use things for their base functional purpose, else you’d be a hypocrite.

Ever take your car out for a joyride with no destination in mind? If you get in an accident on such an unnecessary trip and use Medicare for the bills, can I berate you for not considering your cost to ‘the taxpayers’?

“Face it those that want pot for more than medication are the ones that will be using it solely for their own pleasure”

Exactly.

I want to kick back after work, drink a beer and smoke a doobie, and not have to worry about getting thrown in the clink with murderers and rapists for doing so.

“at the expense of themselves and others”

This isn’t a zero-sum game. A penny doesn’t come out of my pocket every time someone takes a swig of beer, though you’d like to believe that.

“That will cost the user money and if it means a treatment facility, then taxpayers.”

Less than paying to run the jails? I very seriously doubt that.

“So ‘I’ pay for your use.”

I really hope no one in your house is fat.

“All overuse of ANYTHING is bad for the user”

You can’t imagine that anyone would use a drug in moderation, can you?

Are you a recovering addict or something? Are you projecting your own lack of self-control? I’m really trying to figure out why you’re so rabid about this always-uncontrollable-overuse angle.

“That kind of argument is as fallacious as the above barn is open let all the animals out one.”

Metaphors are for weak minds. Try thinking about the situation in terms of itself.

Nothing about drug legalization resembles ‘letting animals out of a barn.’