http://tinyurl.com/knduvp

http://tinyurl.com/looauy

Excellent points. As a unix geek myself, I also get the ^H reference. For future reference though, you can also use the HTML strike tag to make your example look like this instead.

Governments of all persuasions can’t leave the markets alone–otherwise their cronies supporters might go broke.

To do this, what you would type is <strike>cronies</strike>

(I hope I got that right or I’ll look foolish for trying to show you how to do it.)

Talking about health care makes me sick. The present US system doesn’t work. I have yet to see a model that does work.

I do know that when I was young, doctors were well off, and many were wealthy. Then again, large cash flow is not wealth. Nor is it health.

As a sysadmin, I’d be happy to provide free health care for your machine(s). Seriously. It’s just that all of my providers want money.

“Why is that we have a generation of mothers who don’t know how to take care of themselves with all the money the government gives them?“

Huh? I suppose they all drive Welfare Cadillacs too.

Then, just a little while later, in #68, he says:

“The US Constitution does not allow for nationwide welfare programs. The states may implement them if they wish, but the Federal Government may not.”

Make up your mind! Also, what about the phrase in the preamble about promoting the general Welfare?

And a note to #4, ridin the short bus; it’s spelled rhetoric. (I think it’s spelled strangely because it’s from ancient Greek.) Just a word to the wise.

Here’s to your very good health, everybody! (Clink!)

Fact: US cell phone companies only make you sign a 2-year contract for service.

Does this mean that either type of system is better or worse? But this example makes as much sense as many of the arguments here about health care.

Do ya think that what ever it is that draws you to stay in the United States may be associated and/or intertwined with all the those things you think are horrible about the US?

Otherwise, you’d have the same opportunities in Canada and would have stayed in that wonderful country….albeit, to our loss.

hey to break it to yaz, but its not a
repub-dem problem..

I don’t agree with the rest of your post, but this much is true. In 1974, it was Richard Nixon who introduced a plan that would have created a government health insurance policy into which anyone could buy on a sliding scale based on the person’s income. It would have competed with our other insurers. By now, most of our crappy insurers would likely be out of business.

can a SysOp please delete the paragraph below the -s in post #83 please?

thank you.

-s

our entire government is corrupted to the core. until we address that problem, any
“government solution” will result in more
of the same. -we the people, being taken to the cleaners and 10+ generations worth of our kids will foot the bill..

-s

doesn’t we eliminate the rampant corruption in our
government, from the white house on down,
ANYTHING our gov attempts to run will

Free markets are great but what they’ve left us with is corporate health care that’s more respondant to the shareholder than the patient.

I surely believe there are many good physicians out there who are just working within the system to do the best job they can.

But when much of the system, i.e. insurance, is predicated on making sure they cover as few cases as possible (what happened to the thousands I’ve put into my plans over the years?), clearly free market healthcare isn’t working.

The soundbites out of opponents to basically any kind of change here like to present doomsday scenarios that simply haven’t happened in other countries.

They like to quote 6 mos for a hip replacement while totally ignoring the number of Americans going into bankruptcy due to medical bills.

They’d rather bash another system than propose anything new for us. Meanwhile benefits shrink to nothing and costs continue to rise. Insurers get richer and the general public goes broke trying to make up the difference.

Yea that’s a wonderful system we Americans have. Good for us, it’s free market. YEA! Like that proves anything.

You know when they openly say they aren’t going to pay for the expense items in health care, that rationing is coming.

They will control everything you eat, drink, or do all in the name of the common good and universal health care.

Who exactly are “they”? The government as opposed to the health insurance companies? Do you not see that the rationing is already here?

Right now, the rationing is done by people whose charter explicitly requires them to deny you care at every opportunity. And, they’re good at it.

If we get a better system in place, it will be run by people whose charter is to provide the best possible care. And, they’ll likely be bad at it.

Still the results of the latter will be better than the former as even incompetent people do at least make an attempt to do their jobs.

Besides, remember, there are government employees who actually do their job well. I’ve never lost a piece of mail in the post office. I still find the results of the postal service better than Fedex or UPS. And the post office is cheaper.

As for who will be deciding what is and is not covered, most government programs in other countries have panel discussions with doctors, patient advocacy groups, government representatives and others who all get together in an open forum and discuss issues like life sustaining care, quality adjusted life years (QALYs), cost per QALY, etc.

Right now, the rationing is done by wealth.

And, wealth may not always help. Sometimes, it may get you stuck on life support for 8 months until your wealth runs out before finally someone pulls the plug allowing the meat that was once you to finally die.

Sometimes, with wealth comes unnecessary medication. Despite consuming 56% of the world’s medication with just 4% of the world’s population, the U.S. still has the worst overall stats among the developed democratic nations of the world.

Sometimes, with wealth comes unnecessary surgery. We have the highest rate of cesarean sections. Because of this, we have actually removed a lot of the selective force for smaller heads at birth, thus causing more c-sections in future generations. Soon we may become a race of humans that cannot give birth vaginally at all.

They are sold food, they are sold the promise of food, the allure of food, the benefits of food.

Unfortunately, “caveat emptor” applies and Americans get screwed, once again.

Speaking as one of the unemployed, and therefore uninsured, I find myself back at the same point we were all at _before_ Nixon signed a pact which made Humana very, very rich by forcing employers to pay for health care.

Since HMOs like to make money, the bills to the employers keep going up and up.

Since HMOs like to hang onto money, the service delivered to the patients keeps going down and down.

Plain and simple.

And if I get sick?

I have the same option my father had back before socialized medicine in Québec.

Die and get it over with or get treated until you’re broke and then die, and get it over with.

I have seen and used the systems on both sides of the border.

The US one is far more schizophrenic and on a downward spiral.