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	<title>Comments on: Wages Rise, If You Have A Job, That Is</title>
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	<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/</link>
	<description>General interest observations and true web-log.</description>
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		<title>By: ECA</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-2/#comment-1575067</link>
		<dc:creator>ECA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 21:54:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1575067</guid>
		<description>yes, you fire 2000 workers, and you can get rid of 20-50 PAPER Shufflers, and 2-3 boss&#039;s(maybe) and others along the LINE of employment.
They solved most of that, by using a Time and ATTENDANCE system AT the job site.(Floppy backup(LMAO)).

it comes down to HOW much can you work 5 people over 10 people to clean up and maintain your OFFICES.  1 person gets sick, and SPIT happens.

Knock off your sales force, and what happens to the BOSS&#039;s wages?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yes, you fire 2000 workers, and you can get rid of 20-50 PAPER Shufflers, and 2-3 boss&#8217;s(maybe) and others along the LINE of employment.<br />
They solved most of that, by using a Time and ATTENDANCE system AT the job site.(Floppy backup(LMAO)).</p>
<p>it comes down to HOW much can you work 5 people over 10 people to clean up and maintain your OFFICES.  1 person gets sick, and SPIT happens.</p>
<p>Knock off your sales force, and what happens to the BOSS&#8217;s wages?</p>
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		<title>By: ECA</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-2/#comment-1575064</link>
		<dc:creator>ECA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 21:48:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1575064</guid>
		<description>Mike,
Avg wage may go up, but NOT on the bottom..
Its the persons on TOP that get the INCENTIVE BONUS..which OUR BOSS, got.

Tell those numbers to the person making $5, when the person making $50+ per hour is still working..

Yes, I understand that the person making $5 per hour is getting Employer paid fees to state and fed.  Which is about 1/2 of his wage.  But those Fees ARENT THERE if you figure he is UNDER 32 hours.  Only thing that is extra is the Workers trying to figure out his hours, at the office that are getting $12 per hour.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike,<br />
Avg wage may go up, but NOT on the bottom..<br />
Its the persons on TOP that get the INCENTIVE BONUS..which OUR BOSS, got.</p>
<p>Tell those numbers to the person making $5, when the person making $50+ per hour is still working..</p>
<p>Yes, I understand that the person making $5 per hour is getting Employer paid fees to state and fed.  Which is about 1/2 of his wage.  But those Fees ARENT THERE if you figure he is UNDER 32 hours.  Only thing that is extra is the Workers trying to figure out his hours, at the office that are getting $12 per hour.</p>
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		<title>By: MikeR</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-2/#comment-1575035</link>
		<dc:creator>MikeR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:44:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1575035</guid>
		<description>ECA - think carefully how averages work.

You have 500 people working:
200 make $5 an hour
200 make $10 an hour
100 make $15 an hour

It costs the corp $1000 + $2000 + $1500 = $4500 per hour to employ these 500 people.  The average worker makes $9 per hour ($4500/500) 

It lay off time. Let&#039;s say all 200 people making $5 an hour are let go.  Now the labour costs are $2000 + $1500 = $3500 per hour to employee 300 people.

Guess what!  Average wage for those 300 people is $11.67 per hour.  So, the average wage has gone up but no one is making more money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ECA &#8211; think carefully how averages work.</p>
<p>You have 500 people working:<br />
200 make $5 an hour<br />
200 make $10 an hour<br />
100 make $15 an hour</p>
<p>It costs the corp $1000 + $2000 + $1500 = $4500 per hour to employ these 500 people.  The average worker makes $9 per hour ($4500/500) </p>
<p>It lay off time. Let&#8217;s say all 200 people making $5 an hour are let go.  Now the labour costs are $2000 + $1500 = $3500 per hour to employee 300 people.</p>
<p>Guess what!  Average wage for those 300 people is $11.67 per hour.  So, the average wage has gone up but no one is making more money.</p>
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		<title>By: ECA</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1575021</link>
		<dc:creator>ECA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 20:17:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1575021</guid>
		<description>MIKE??

WRONG..

Tell that to the corp and they will LAUGH AT YOU, they might even bust open and fall on the floor and DIE(WISH)..

Tell that to FRED Meyers in the 90&#039;s when we went from 500 workers to 300 in 2 years..TELL me I got a Larger wage...PLEASE tell me I didnt get CUT back to 32hours or LESS...and lost my benefits..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MIKE??</p>
<p>WRONG..</p>
<p>Tell that to the corp and they will LAUGH AT YOU, they might even bust open and fall on the floor and DIE(WISH)..</p>
<p>Tell that to FRED Meyers in the 90&#8242;s when we went from 500 workers to 300 in 2 years..TELL me I got a Larger wage&#8230;PLEASE tell me I didnt get CUT back to 32hours or LESS&#8230;and lost my benefits..</p>
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		<title>By: MikeR</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1575011</link>
		<dc:creator>MikeR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 19:49:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1575011</guid>
		<description>Uhmm.. When you lay off the lowest paid earners, of course the average wage for those still working will increase.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Uhmm.. When you lay off the lowest paid earners, of course the average wage for those still working will increase.</p>
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		<title>By: ECA</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574755</link>
		<dc:creator>ECA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 03:41:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574755</guid>
		<description>Ripple, TJ swan, Mad dog, Thunderbird..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ripple, TJ swan, Mad dog, Thunderbird..</p>
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		<title>By: Raff</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574737</link>
		<dc:creator>Raff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Sep 2009 02:17:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574737</guid>
		<description>What kind of wine goes with unemployment? 

&quot;Do I have to look for a job?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What kind of wine goes with unemployment? </p>
<p>&#8220;Do I have to look for a job?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: m.c. in l.v.</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574660</link>
		<dc:creator>m.c. in l.v.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 23:13:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574660</guid>
		<description>I have a job but no rising wages for me this year. Got the official email last week from the CEO basically saying be thankful you have a job in this down tourist economy. Oh well, what ya gonna do?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have a job but no rising wages for me this year. Got the official email last week from the CEO basically saying be thankful you have a job in this down tourist economy. Oh well, what ya gonna do?</p>
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		<title>By: smartalix</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574654</link>
		<dc:creator>smartalix</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 23:03:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574654</guid>
		<description>Not to mention there are industries, like publishing, that would be in trouble now regardless of the economy due to disruptive technology. Salaries are not rising in the magazine and newspaper business, as far as I can see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not to mention there are industries, like publishing, that would be in trouble now regardless of the economy due to disruptive technology. Salaries are not rising in the magazine and newspaper business, as far as I can see.</p>
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		<title>By: ECA</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574621</link>
		<dc:creator>ECA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 21:40:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574621</guid>
		<description>I had a great post for this, but the site went down.

It used to be that we could afford to have 1 person making money to feed the family.
When 2 persons worked there was alittle bit to save and use to make a better living.
Corps wish 2 things.
THEY WANT YOUR MONEY.
THEY WANT TO DO IT CHEAP.
As quality has gone down, Prices have gone up.
They are getting MORE profit with LESS.  and where is the money going?
OWNERS/CEO/Major wage earners POCKETS and STOCKS.  The WHOLE market is inflated.
If a Corp would fire 1-3 Major Earners you could save a WHOLE work force of the lower paid worker, 200-1000 very easily.
Some IDIOT economist awhile back made a statement, but DIDNT explain it well.
&quot;If the economy rises 3% per year, thats a good thing&quot;.
HE DIDNT SAY the price of goods/services could go up.  but they have.
A few things THE USA did has also made it WORSE.  Tariff on Wood products from Canada, 25%.. AFTER we sell off our wood to CHINA, then charge the USA tax payer MORE for the goods we SOLD to another nation, raising Building prices.
Sending METALS to china, at 3 times the going PRICE on an international TRADE, and THEN raising prices NATIONALLY to match.  Raised Building and car prices thru the ROOF.
Corps trying to make MORE profit the SAME OLD WAY..  Cutting the lower wage workers TO/FOR even LOWER PAID WORKERS.  And thinking that it saves money, when all they NEED DO, is FIRE 2-3 of the HIGHER PAID BOSS&#039;S.  But those FOLKS have CONTRACTS that make UNION LABOR look like FIRST YEAR LAWYERS.
So why not SEND the WHOLE company OUT OF THE USA.  To the same place they sent OUR WORK.  Boss&#039;s over there make 1/10the what they do in the USA.  And in China, if you SCREW UP, they chop off your head.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had a great post for this, but the site went down.</p>
<p>It used to be that we could afford to have 1 person making money to feed the family.<br />
When 2 persons worked there was alittle bit to save and use to make a better living.<br />
Corps wish 2 things.<br />
THEY WANT YOUR MONEY.<br />
THEY WANT TO DO IT CHEAP.<br />
As quality has gone down, Prices have gone up.<br />
They are getting MORE profit with LESS.  and where is the money going?<br />
OWNERS/CEO/Major wage earners POCKETS and STOCKS.  The WHOLE market is inflated.<br />
If a Corp would fire 1-3 Major Earners you could save a WHOLE work force of the lower paid worker, 200-1000 very easily.<br />
Some IDIOT economist awhile back made a statement, but DIDNT explain it well.<br />
&#8220;If the economy rises 3% per year, thats a good thing&#8221;.<br />
HE DIDNT SAY the price of goods/services could go up.  but they have.<br />
A few things THE USA did has also made it WORSE.  Tariff on Wood products from Canada, 25%.. AFTER we sell off our wood to CHINA, then charge the USA tax payer MORE for the goods we SOLD to another nation, raising Building prices.<br />
Sending METALS to china, at 3 times the going PRICE on an international TRADE, and THEN raising prices NATIONALLY to match.  Raised Building and car prices thru the ROOF.<br />
Corps trying to make MORE profit the SAME OLD WAY..  Cutting the lower wage workers TO/FOR even LOWER PAID WORKERS.  And thinking that it saves money, when all they NEED DO, is FIRE 2-3 of the HIGHER PAID BOSS&#8217;S.  But those FOLKS have CONTRACTS that make UNION LABOR look like FIRST YEAR LAWYERS.<br />
So why not SEND the WHOLE company OUT OF THE USA.  To the same place they sent OUR WORK.  Boss&#8217;s over there make 1/10the what they do in the USA.  And in China, if you SCREW UP, they chop off your head.</p>
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		<title>By: amodedoma</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574532</link>
		<dc:creator>amodedoma</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 17:02:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574532</guid>
		<description>Oh great, good news, those that haven&#039;t lost their jobs recently may receive a pay raise to adjust their wages to the rate of inflation.  Ummm, what that really means is the few people that are still working may not find their standard of living lowered by runaway inflation, for a while at least...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh great, good news, those that haven&#8217;t lost their jobs recently may receive a pay raise to adjust their wages to the rate of inflation.  Ummm, what that really means is the few people that are still working may not find their standard of living lowered by runaway inflation, for a while at least&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: MikeN</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574531</link>
		<dc:creator>MikeN</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 17:01:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574531</guid>
		<description>A minimum wage increase was passed not too long ago.  Higher minimum wage equals lower employment, unless your wages are already do high the minimum wage increase doesn&#039;t matter, or your overall employment increases more than the minimum wage increase shrinks it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A minimum wage increase was passed not too long ago.  Higher minimum wage equals lower employment, unless your wages are already do high the minimum wage increase doesn&#8217;t matter, or your overall employment increases more than the minimum wage increase shrinks it.</p>
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		<title>By: RSweeney</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574524</link>
		<dc:creator>RSweeney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 16:45:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574524</guid>
		<description>Look under any urban highway overpass.

The whines of choice for the unemployed (and unemployable) are Thunderbird and Night Train.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Look under any urban highway overpass.</p>
<p>The whines of choice for the unemployed (and unemployable) are Thunderbird and Night Train.</p>
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		<title>By: Postman</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574515</link>
		<dc:creator>Postman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 16:30:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574515</guid>
		<description>#6,

The specific anecdote you are looking for goes something like this...

If you ask a mathematician what the sum of 1 + 1 is they will respond 2.

If you ask a good accountant what the sum of 1 + 1 is they will respond with, &quot;what number did you have in mind?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#6,</p>
<p>The specific anecdote you are looking for goes something like this&#8230;</p>
<p>If you ask a mathematician what the sum of 1 + 1 is they will respond 2.</p>
<p>If you ask a good accountant what the sum of 1 + 1 is they will respond with, &#8220;what number did you have in mind?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: deowll</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/09/07/wages-rise-if-you-have-a-job-that-is/comment-page-1/#comment-1574502</link>
		<dc:creator>deowll</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Sep 2009 15:40:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=57571#comment-1574502</guid>
		<description>#7 Smoke and mirrors, people, just like the BS justifications for the war in Iraq…

I thought Obama was pulling out no matter what even if it meant Iran or somebody took over?

I mean we don&#039;t care about the price of oil any more do we? I thought cap and trade was going to fix that?

That last was sarcasm just in case you missed it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#7 Smoke and mirrors, people, just like the BS justifications for the war in Iraq…</p>
<p>I thought Obama was pulling out no matter what even if it meant Iran or somebody took over?</p>
<p>I mean we don&#8217;t care about the price of oil any more do we? I thought cap and trade was going to fix that?</p>
<p>That last was sarcasm just in case you missed it.</p>
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