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	<title>Comments on: Nobel Prize winning scientist: Cap-and-trade will ruin the US economy</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/</link>
	<description>General interest observations and true web-log.</description>
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		<title>By: henrylow</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1612591</link>
		<dc:creator>henrylow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 04:12:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1612591</guid>
		<description>1.	Often we forget the little guy, the SMB, in our discussions of the comings and goings of the Internet marketing industry. Sure there are times like this when a report surfaces talking about their issues and concerns but, for the most part, we like to talk about big brands and how they do the Internet marketing thing well or not so well.

                    www.onlineuniversalwork.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1.	Often we forget the little guy, the SMB, in our discussions of the comings and goings of the Internet marketing industry. Sure there are times like this when a report surfaces talking about their issues and concerns but, for the most part, we like to talk about big brands and how they do the Internet marketing thing well or not so well.</p>
<p>                    <a href="http://www.onlineuniversalwork.com" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"></a><a href='http://www.onlineuniversalwork.com' rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.onlineuniversalwork.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: Rick Cain</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1597047</link>
		<dc:creator>Rick Cain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 04:29:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1597047</guid>
		<description>All cap and trade will do is move pollution to poor neighborhoods.  That&#039;s the whole point anyway, rich people don&#039;t want smokestacks visible from their private compounds.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All cap and trade will do is move pollution to poor neighborhoods.  That&#8217;s the whole point anyway, rich people don&#8217;t want smokestacks visible from their private compounds.</p>
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		<title>By: LibertyLover</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596851</link>
		<dc:creator>LibertyLover</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 19:11:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596851</guid>
		<description>#36, Actually, I am.  I would not send my kid to a school that wouldn&#039;t prepare him for a successful future.

And I don&#039;t know any parents who would.

How many do you know who would send their kid to a school that taught underwater basket weaving vs. electronics repair or chemistry or computer science?

&lt;i&gt;Vouchers are the surest way to guarantee that public education will go out of business&lt;/i&gt;

Public education isn&#039;t a business.  If it was, we would be better off (assuming it wasn&#039;t regulated to death).

I keep hearing from you guys how a public health option would be no worse than the current private solution.  How much worse could a private education solution be?  Let&#039;s try it out.  If it doesn&#039;t work, the public schools will thrive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#36, Actually, I am.  I would not send my kid to a school that wouldn&#8217;t prepare him for a successful future.</p>
<p>And I don&#8217;t know any parents who would.</p>
<p>How many do you know who would send their kid to a school that taught underwater basket weaving vs. electronics repair or chemistry or computer science?</p>
<p><i>Vouchers are the surest way to guarantee that public education will go out of business</i></p>
<p>Public education isn&#8217;t a business.  If it was, we would be better off (assuming it wasn&#8217;t regulated to death).</p>
<p>I keep hearing from you guys how a public health option would be no worse than the current private solution.  How much worse could a private education solution be?  Let&#8217;s try it out.  If it doesn&#8217;t work, the public schools will thrive.</p>
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		<title>By: peter dublin</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596744</link>
		<dc:creator>peter dublin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 12:20:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596744</guid>
		<description>Yes there are many reasons why cap and trade are wrong,
whether or not you believe that emissions should be lowered

&lt;a href=&quot;http://ceolas.net/#cce5x&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Emission Trading  (Cap and Trade)&lt;/a&gt;
Basic Idea -- Offsets -- Tree Planting -- Manufacture Shift -- Fair Trade -- Surreal Market -- Allowances: Auctions + Hand-Outs -- Allowance Trading -- Companies: Business Stability + Cost -- In Conclusion

As it happens,
if there is to be an emission policy,
Electricity and Transport sectors alone (80% of emissions) are sufficient to meet emission reduction targets,
with measures advantageous in themselves (including energy renewability, and that emissions contain much else, whatever about CO2), 
long term funded for reduced consumer price impact,
without efficiency regulation, industrial carbon taxes or cap and trade schemes
ceolas.net/#cc1x
.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes there are many reasons why cap and trade are wrong,<br />
whether or not you believe that emissions should be lowered</p>
<p><a href="http://ceolas.net/#cce5x" rel="nofollow" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Emission Trading  (Cap and Trade)</a><br />
Basic Idea &#8212; Offsets &#8212; Tree Planting &#8212; Manufacture Shift &#8212; Fair Trade &#8212; Surreal Market &#8212; Allowances: Auctions + Hand-Outs &#8212; Allowance Trading &#8212; Companies: Business Stability + Cost &#8212; In Conclusion</p>
<p>As it happens,<br />
if there is to be an emission policy,<br />
Electricity and Transport sectors alone (80% of emissions) are sufficient to meet emission reduction targets,<br />
with measures advantageous in themselves (including energy renewability, and that emissions contain much else, whatever about CO2),<br />
long term funded for reduced consumer price impact,<br />
without efficiency regulation, industrial carbon taxes or cap and trade schemes<br />
ceolas.net/#cc1x<br />
.</p>
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		<title>By: Misanthropic Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596657</link>
		<dc:creator>Misanthropic Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 02:52:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596657</guid>
		<description>#36 - Me (correction)

Oops, I meant small government, not strong government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#36 &#8211; Me (correction)</p>
<p>Oops, I meant small government, not strong government.</p>
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		<title>By: Misanthropic Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596654</link>
		<dc:creator>Misanthropic Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 02:44:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596654</guid>
		<description>#34 - LL,

C&#039;mon, you can&#039;t really be so much for strong government that you think that education should be completely privatized, can you? Who will decide the curriculum? Will you be looking forward to a future like that described in the movie Idiocracy where law degrees are given out at costco?

Vouchers are the surest way to guarantee that public education will go out of business ... to be replaced mostly by religious indoctrination. That won&#039;t be good for anyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#34 &#8211; LL,</p>
<p>C&#8217;mon, you can&#8217;t really be so much for strong government that you think that education should be completely privatized, can you? Who will decide the curriculum? Will you be looking forward to a future like that described in the movie Idiocracy where law degrees are given out at costco?</p>
<p>Vouchers are the surest way to guarantee that public education will go out of business &#8230; to be replaced mostly by religious indoctrination. That won&#8217;t be good for anyone.</p>
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		<title>By: Buzz</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596536</link>
		<dc:creator>Buzz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 20:51:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596536</guid>
		<description>Erm... What part of &quot;If... Then...&quot; did you intentionally misplace so you could write that headline?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Erm&#8230; What part of &#8220;If&#8230; Then&#8230;&#8221; did you intentionally misplace so you could write that headline?</p>
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		<title>By: LibertyLover</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596427</link>
		<dc:creator>LibertyLover</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 15:21:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596427</guid>
		<description>#32, &lt;i&gt;We also trail other countries in education because we have no national standards for education.&lt;/i&gt;

Luckily, the federal gov doesn&#039;t have the authority to do that as per the 10th Amendment.

As more people are realizing, the fed gov is taking way to much liberty with OUR liberties.

We are a Republic, not a democracy, not a technocracy, not bureau.  The rules for governing this Republic are spelled out in the Constitution.

If you are that concerned with public education standards, you should look at your state, not mine.

Are only children of wealthy families worthy of a proper education? Certainly only children in relatively well off areas are getting adequate spending on education.

Vouchers.  Instead of creating another fed gov bureaucracy, just give parents a choice instead of mandate.  When low performing public schools find their students disappearing, they will have to compete by actually producing something -- like qualified graduates.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#32, <i>We also trail other countries in education because we have no national standards for education.</i></p>
<p>Luckily, the federal gov doesn&#8217;t have the authority to do that as per the 10th Amendment.</p>
<p>As more people are realizing, the fed gov is taking way to much liberty with OUR liberties.</p>
<p>We are a Republic, not a democracy, not a technocracy, not bureau.  The rules for governing this Republic are spelled out in the Constitution.</p>
<p>If you are that concerned with public education standards, you should look at your state, not mine.</p>
<p>Are only children of wealthy families worthy of a proper education? Certainly only children in relatively well off areas are getting adequate spending on education.</p>
<p>Vouchers.  Instead of creating another fed gov bureaucracy, just give parents a choice instead of mandate.  When low performing public schools find their students disappearing, they will have to compete by actually producing something &#8212; like qualified graduates.</p>
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		<title>By: Alfred1</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596411</link>
		<dc:creator>Alfred1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 14:32:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596411</guid>
		<description>He is right, it will ruin the economy.

But that is what leftist feel we deserve, a ruined economy, to repay the world for our past sins...

But the only sins I see in the past, were those done by leftists...Hitler, Stalin, Fidel, Mao, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He is right, it will ruin the economy.</p>
<p>But that is what leftist feel we deserve, a ruined economy, to repay the world for our past sins&#8230;</p>
<p>But the only sins I see in the past, were those done by leftists&#8230;Hitler, Stalin, Fidel, Mao, etc.</p>
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		<title>By: Misanthropic Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596404</link>
		<dc:creator>Misanthropic Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 14:14:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596404</guid>
		<description>HMeyers,

Actually, I hate high population, not high population density. People should live stacked on top of each other. It&#039;s more cost effective and less damaging on the land. We can&#039;t support billions of humans no matter what we do. But, we can support a hell of a lot more by stacking people on top of each other.

We also trail other countries in education because we have no national standards for education.

Further, a lot of people even in NYC do not have the education level of the average European. So, not just density, but standards. And, a standard level of spending per child nationally wouldn&#039;t be bad either. Are only children of wealthy families worthy of a proper education? Certainly only children in relatively well off areas are getting adequate spending on education. The results are obvious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HMeyers,</p>
<p>Actually, I hate high population, not high population density. People should live stacked on top of each other. It&#8217;s more cost effective and less damaging on the land. We can&#8217;t support billions of humans no matter what we do. But, we can support a hell of a lot more by stacking people on top of each other.</p>
<p>We also trail other countries in education because we have no national standards for education.</p>
<p>Further, a lot of people even in NYC do not have the education level of the average European. So, not just density, but standards. And, a standard level of spending per child nationally wouldn&#8217;t be bad either. Are only children of wealthy families worthy of a proper education? Certainly only children in relatively well off areas are getting adequate spending on education. The results are obvious.</p>
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		<title>By: Hmeyers</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596383</link>
		<dc:creator>Hmeyers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:25:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596383</guid>
		<description>@MS

In summary, the US has one of the highest birthrates in the West (Israel surpasses the USA, Sweden is very close) because of the low population density which makes the USA trail in effective education level.

And education level is factor #1 in birthrate.

Game.  Set. Match.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@MS</p>
<p>In summary, the US has one of the highest birthrates in the West (Israel surpasses the USA, Sweden is very close) because of the low population density which makes the USA trail in effective education level.</p>
<p>And education level is factor #1 in birthrate.</p>
<p>Game.  Set. Match.</p>
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		<title>By: Hmeyers</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596382</link>
		<dc:creator>Hmeyers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:23:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596382</guid>
		<description>@ MS

You are going to hate this and the implications, but so be it ...

Average effective education level is a function of education plus population density.  This is why people in, say, New York city are very educated compared to, say, some little town in Montana.

The United States has a very low population density, think of the red states and rural areas.

So in this paradox, the highest effective education levels are attained with HIGH population densities.

Which is the thing you hate, hehe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ MS</p>
<p>You are going to hate this and the implications, but so be it &#8230;</p>
<p>Average effective education level is a function of education plus population density.  This is why people in, say, New York city are very educated compared to, say, some little town in Montana.</p>
<p>The United States has a very low population density, think of the red states and rural areas.</p>
<p>So in this paradox, the highest effective education levels are attained with HIGH population densities.</p>
<p>Which is the thing you hate, hehe.</p>
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		<title>By: Misanthropic Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596373</link>
		<dc:creator>Misanthropic Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 11:33:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596373</guid>
		<description>HMeyers,

The tax incentives for births in this country likely are having a small effect now and are highly immoral given the world population.

You may note that in my second paragraph, I said to increase &lt;b&gt;worldwide&lt;/b&gt; access to birth control.

As for your three factors, that is mostly true. However, none of them explain why the wealthiest nation in the world, the U.S., has the highest birthrate in the developed democratic world.

I think you may have left out religiosity or some other form of irrationality that gives the U.S. the only birthrate above replacement among developed democratic nations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HMeyers,</p>
<p>The tax incentives for births in this country likely are having a small effect now and are highly immoral given the world population.</p>
<p>You may note that in my second paragraph, I said to increase <b>worldwide</b> access to birth control.</p>
<p>As for your three factors, that is mostly true. However, none of them explain why the wealthiest nation in the world, the U.S., has the highest birthrate in the developed democratic world.</p>
<p>I think you may have left out religiosity or some other form of irrationality that gives the U.S. the only birthrate above replacement among developed democratic nations.</p>
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		<title>By: Hmeyers</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596244</link>
		<dc:creator>Hmeyers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Nov 2009 00:10:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596244</guid>
		<description>@ Fusion

We didn&#039;t provide birth control to China to cause this to happen.

The police state mandated it.

Now if you want to argue someone should pay the third world governments to do the police state/mandate one-child thing I&#039;m all ears.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Fusion</p>
<p>We didn&#8217;t provide birth control to China to cause this to happen.</p>
<p>The police state mandated it.</p>
<p>Now if you want to argue someone should pay the third world governments to do the police state/mandate one-child thing I&#8217;m all ears.</p>
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		<title>By: Mr. Fusion</title>
		<link>http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/10/31/nobel-prize-winning-scientist-cap-and-trade-will-ruin-the-us-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-1596239</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr. Fusion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Oct 2009 23:52:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=61615#comment-1596239</guid>
		<description>#25, Hmeyers,

&lt;i&gt;#3 Please explain how providing birth control access to women in countries without education, without democracy and without women’s rights is going to work and provide one success story country.&lt;/i&gt;


China. 

Because they realized that they couldn&#039;t feed/house/employ everyone at the rate of growth they experienced. While China&#039;s population has continued to grow, it is much less than if no actions were taken.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#25, Hmeyers,</p>
<p><i>#3 Please explain how providing birth control access to women in countries without education, without democracy and without women’s rights is going to work and provide one success story country.</i></p>
<p>China. </p>
<p>Because they realized that they couldn&#8217;t feed/house/employ everyone at the rate of growth they experienced. While China&#8217;s population has continued to grow, it is much less than if no actions were taken.</p>
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