When the US is lectured by others on our human rights record, you know we’ve lost our way.

Ecuador’s leftist government thumbed its nose at Washington on Thursday by renouncing U.S. trade benefits and offering to pay for human rights training in America in response to pressure over asylum for former intelligence contractor Edward Snowden.

The angry response threatens a showdown between the two nations over Snowden, and may burnish President Rafael Correa’s credentials to be the continent’s principal challenger of U.S. power after the death of Venezuelan socialist leader Hugo Chavez.

“Ecuador will not accept pressures or threats from anyone, and it does not traffic in its values or allow them to be subjugated to mercantile interests,” government spokesman Fernando Alvarado said at a news conference.



  1. pedro says:

    “…President Rafael Correa’s credentials to be the continent’s principal challenger of U.S. power after the death of Venezuelan socialist leader Hugo Chavez”

    Hahahaha, how naive can people be? They are two puppets from habana.

    In the meantime, Ecuador closed newspapers & tv station because they talked ugly against Correa. Who’s the hypocrite?

    http://google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5ijBgLg3X10LlXUXAqwamEsPAW1Cg

    Oh, the irony indeed!

    • NobodySpecial says:

      What a bizarre system, the president chooses who runs the TV and newspapers !
      Isn’t it normally the other way around?

      • pedro says:

        Is like that in all commie countries. If you studied history, you would’ve known

        • jpfitz says:

          What have you to say about the current American media and Journalism? What’s the difference if any?

          • pedro says:

            Are we talking about “regimes” or about the press?

          • jpfitz says:

            Pedro, I was pointing at the current “regime” swaying the reporting of all TV news and media in the Nation, TV only news info may not be the truth. Alternative info and a scan of the msm will give a better picture of the “truth”.

            This control is not much different than what happened in Latin America.

          • pedro says:

            You’re missing part of the picture in latin america.

            Besides doing what I posted, all these cuban proxy regimes (venezuela, nicaragua, ecuador, bolivia, etc.) have created a whole network of “alternative” media outlets by either directly seizing or creating new tv stations, radio stations, printed press and blogs (most of them hosted so ironically in the US and accepting paypal donations).

            As an example, before the castros got power in venezuela thru the chavez traitor, the government only had 1 tv station (out of 6 tv stations total), 1 radio station and only 1 news outlet (called venpress). Nowadays, they directly control 3 of those tv stations and 2 more indirectly with government personnel inside their boards of directors plus they’ve created 4 more tv stations and a cable news channel, about 20 % of the radio stations are now theirs directly or thru what they call “community media” effort, even an “armed forces” radio station broadcasting directly inside their main military facility in the capital city (which is full of cuban G2 elements)

            That hasn’t happened yet in the US, but I also see what you mean going on in the US

  2. pedro says:

    “The closure of another independent media outlet and numerous public comments made by President Rafael Correa attacking private media are an alarming illustration of Correa’s growing attempts to silence critical media. Freedom House calls on President Correa to retract his order preventing government officials from speaking to private media and to allow all journalists and media organizations to operate without interference.

    During his weekly radio address on June 9, Correa asked government ministers to stop granting interviews to private media whom he claims are “corrupt.” Political coordinator Betty Tola confirmed at a press conference on June 12 that cabinet members would refuse to grant interviews to private media, because he said they received “clear instructions” from Correa. These actions were demonstrated when Minister of Interior, Jose Serrano canceled his interview with the television station Ecuvisa. During the 42nd Session of the General Assembly of the Organization of American States (OAS), Correa attacked the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights (IACHR) and its Special Rapporteur on Freedom of Expression, claiming they were working to protect ‘private media interests.’”

    http://freedomhouse.org/article/correa-continues-attempts-silence-independent-media-ecuador

    Irony abounds.

    • deowll says:

      Is this like when Obama said Fox wasn’t a news organization and tried to ban their rep from attending press conferences?

  3. bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

    As Pedro adroitly explains above–mere criticism from other State Actors does not mean the USA has lost its way… merely that there is a discussion/propaganda afoot.

    No–every nation at every time has things in errors, progress to be made. Degrees of hypocrisy aside, no Nation is pure–not ever–even the USA.

    My favorite: declaration of the common humanity of man coming from Slave Owners. We can gloss over this sweetcake, enjoy the irony, or consider all statements a stretch goal.

    Yeah, Verily!

  4. Dallas says:

    I’m not concerned about human rights lectures by leftist governments. The only thing happening in Equador is the land area of the Galápagos Islands

    • Jorge Rhor says:

      Damn. You truly don’t know anything about Ecuador.
      You must feel so proud of yourself.

      • Dallas says:

        The only thing I care to know is it’s some lefty place near the equator across from where big turtles live. The rest I can google and then know more about it then you.

    • The Mick says:

      Coming from a lefty your answers are always puzzling. I don’t believe you have a political philosophy, unless you call “blind worship” a philosophy.

      Face it, if it’s not about being gay, you’re not concerned about human rights at all are you?

      • Dallas says:

        Well, I respond to individual issues.

        It’s clowns like you that like to label people because you like things organized like mommy taught you.

    • pedro says:

      “I’m not concerned about human rights lectures by leftist governments. ”

      The hypocrite hath spoken

      • jpfitz says:

        I am dumbfounded, Pedro, you and I are in agreement. Wake up Dallas, other parts of the planet need our attention, not necessarily the IMF type of attention, but humanitarian.

  5. MWD78 says:

    time to send in the economic hitmen.

  6. MikeN says:

    Ecuador and Corrie should remember that Obama got mad at Honduras for exiling its president who Obama liked. Threatened all sorts of punishment unless they let him back in. If Obama gets mad, he might just lock up all those bananas for inspection, and have lots of accidental dropping of bombs from drones in Ecuador. Oops, we said Egypt, my bad!

    • Dallas says:

      Bush invaded Iraq because Saddam called his daddy a pussy. I wrote down that you had celebrated this invasion.

      • Tim says:

        And they had that lovely tile mural of Mr. Prudent in the sidewalk outside the courthouse or bank (I don’t remember which) that one was required by law to spit on upon entering and exiting.

        George Herbert Walker (Stony-Pussy-Opium-Poppy) Bush.

        • jpfitz says:

          please explain your comment about a mural.

          • Tim says:

            In the late ’90s’, I saw a news report with video of a ‘mural’ in tile of George HW Bush out in front of some state building in Bagdad that people had to spit on as they passed over — my googling is not that good, I’ll look. You look to please.

          • Tim says:

            jpfitz, this is what I was thinking of:

            A tile mosaic depicting U.S. President George H.W. Bush with a look of astonishment on his face was installed on the floor of the lobby after the Persian Gulf War. This was intended to force any visitors to walk over his face to enter the hotel (a serious insult in Arab culture). On 17 January 1993, the hotel was damaged in a US missile strike and the attack resulted in civilian casualties.[1] The artist, Layla Al-Attar, who did the mosaic died along with her husband and housekeeper when another stray US missile hit her house. After the invasion in 2003, the mosaic was smashed by U.S. soldiers, who left a portrait of Saddam Hussein behind.[2]

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rixos_Al_Rasheed_Baghdad_Hotel

            http://iraqpictures.org/george-bush-on-the-floor/

            I would have thought that Dallas, a layer of tile and despiser of Bush, would have immediately recognized that the term I so miserably fumbled around was *mosaic*. And then take pride in supplying us the answer.

            Indeed, I should think he would make quite a lot on the side by telling the clients “for an extra grand, I’ll do a custom self-staining MOSAIC of Bush inside the great white throne.”

        • jpfitz says:

          I googled before asking for clarification. I just binged and found a mural in Northern Ireland that you don’t need to spit on but admire.

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Bush_belfast.jpg

          • Tim says:

            Damn! He beat me to it. I’ve always wanted to dig Reagan’s skull up and smoke pot out of it.

      • NewformatSux says:

        Sorry, I lost my notebook that day. What should I have put you down for hen Bill Clinton bombed Saddam the day of his impeachment?

        George Bush Sr invaded Iraq, Bill Clinton kept it up and continued it, and W Jr escalated.

        • Dallas says:

          Nice try but alluding that the two wars with Iraq are related is comical. Shame on you for a doing a poor job at creating a red herring.

          Put me down for applauding Mr Clinton in continuing his foreign policy and executive obligations while the GOP obsessed over the Oval office cock sucking.

          • pedro says:

            “Bush invaded Iraq because Saddam called his daddy a pussy”

            “Nice try but alluding that the two wars with Iraq are related is comical.”

            Comical indeed!

  7. Captain Obvious says:

    It’s worth reading The Guantánamo Memoirs of Mohamedou Ould Slahi. It put’s a human face on things.

    Excerpt:
    I considered the arrival to Cuba a blessing, and so I told my brothers, “Since you guys are not involved in crimes you need to fear nothing. I personally am going to cooperate, since nobody is going to torture me. I don’t want any of you to suffer what I suffered in Jordan.” I wrongly believed that the worst was over, and cared less about the time it would take the Americans to figure out I am not the guy they are looking for. I trusted the American justice system too much, and shared that trust with people from European countries. We all have an idea about how the democratic system works.

  8. Greg Allen says:

    >>When the US is lectured by others on our human rights record, you know we’ve lost our way.

    It makes me dizzy to hear conservatives concerned about what other countries think about America’s human right riecord.

    • The Mick says:

      Hmmm, weren’t you one of those so-called “liberals” who said nothing when Obama signed NDAA and stripped away your civil rights?

    • The Mick says:

      Or were you one of those limp-dick liberals who said you were “disappointed”.

      • Monk says:

        No, for me it was on October 26, 2001. The Patriot act Bush Signed into law, when our rights Started to erode.
        I did not hear you say anything when Bush who signed The Patriot act and “stripped away your civil rights”
        Another provision of the USA PATRIOT Act has caused a great deal of consternation amongst librarians. Section 215 allows the FBI to apply for an order to produce materials that assist in an investigation undertaken to protect against international terrorism or clandestine intelligence activities. Among the “tangible things” that could be targeted, it includes “books, records, papers, documents, and other items”
        Perhaps one of the biggest controversies involved the use of NSLs by the FBI. Because they allow the FBI to search telephone, email, and financial records without a court order, they were criticized by many parties. In November 2005, BusinessWeek reported that the FBI had issued tens of thousands of NSLs and had obtained one million financial, credit, employment, and in some cases, health records from the customers of targeted Las Vegas businesses.
        Limp Dick? well at least I have a Dick..You?

        • The Mick says:

          Another moron who thinks you’re either for Obama or you were for Bush.

          Put your limp dick back in your panties Skippy. You’re irrelevant.

        • deowll says:

          And both parties voted for the bleeping bill. Of course Obama voted against it and said it was immoral and no he enforces it. Yeah right.

  9. JudgeHooker says:

    Funny – isn’t Ecuador’s national currency the good ol US Dollar? Don’t think this will go very far.

    • ± says:

      You must be a D/R voter. There are a few people on this blog smart enuff (non-R/D voters) to understand exactly how much power Ecuador has over events in the USA after 12 years of banking on the dollar. You’re not one of them.

  10. Tim says:

    “On Wednesday, Senate Foreign Relations Committee Chairman Bob Menendez of New Jersey said that if Ecuador grants asylum, “I will lead the effort to prevent the renewal of Ecuador’s duty-free access under GSP and will also make sure there is no chance for renewal of the Andean Trade Promotion and Drug Eradication Act.”

    “The program, initially meant to help Andean countries aiding in the fight against drugs…”

    http://breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2013/06/27/Ecuador-renounces-trade-benefits-from-US-Congress

    Looks like we just lost like a trillion dollars in imposed drug peace.

    • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

      …. or saved a trillion. Most foreign aid programs are barely disguised payments to domestic international arms manufacturers. Very little benefit to the people of the “helped” country outside of the military getting some toys and training.

      Just watch—it will be the defense industry that lobbies Against removing aid.

      • Tim says:

        I whole-heartedly agree there, bobo. And add to the Lockheed types the CIA, DEA, FBI, local cops, the dog-catcher, the carpet-cleaner, and Nancy Regan’s psychic connection, …

        As with most foreign aid, but especially in all things ‘drug war’ related’, this country does not dole out because of the goodness of it’s heart or so that little timmy won’t fuck up his life by inhaling the free and natural cure for ADHD and cancer.

        It was Bush in 1961 put together the so called ‘Single Convention Treaty {against drugs and marijuana} that forbade it world-wide — an edict to be imposed world-wide. This ‘aid’ has always been to continue the lie. It props up the price while protecting the competition. It is a kind of financial ‘force-multiplier.’

        The really twisted part is that it was not about the ‘drug’ marijuana but the fiber ‘hemp’; “…It was top-secret that the single most important factor to national security in 1961 was to maintain our economic dominance and key to that dominance was deemed to be textiles…” — Paraphrased, Senator Ernest Frederick “Fritz” Hollings {D. South Carolina}

        I saw him say that on C-span and wish I could find a clip now.

        • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

          What kind of time warp is your bubble in? Heavy on the **60′s. Nothing wrong with that, good context blah, blah==but is your memory THAT good, or do you google like mad?

          From what you say, I’ll just assume but call it a memory that in the 60′s, the Carolina’s/South still had a garment/rug industry that did rely on textiles. Fritz Hollings straight from Central Castings can not be imagined any other way than standing up for textiles/anti-UnAmerican Hemp/and grits.

          Wrapping yourself in the Flag while receiving special interest funding…… meet the new Boss.

          • Tim says:

            Well, I do have lucid moments of clarity from time to time when I’m not busy liking turtles or staring at my hand or the sky (and seeing the same thing) and thinking aloud *pretty*.

            Other than that, I call it the ‘hemp repression model’ and my view of the world has proved to be a working one as far as prediction goes — Is that not the test of any model; That it’s verified after many forecasts of future events prove to be correct? That is something *climate* models lack, might I digress.

            In this case, this country has taken us all to hell in the name of Rayon, Dacron, and Nylon to win against the evil other hemp which does not need big oil, big pharma, big monsanto.

            What is that word? Antithisis? I never noticed that particular light-beam coming out of that follicule on my left hand before….

        • jpfitz says:

          Hemp is the enemy of big oil, clear cutting for pulp and on and on. The cheapest form of useful products just from a wild weed. No money for the industry magnets in place since the industrial revolution.

  11. orchidcup says:

    How fortunate for governments that the people they administer don’t think.

    As soon as by one’s own propaganda even a glimpse of right on the other side is admitted, the cause for doubting one’s own right is laid.

    – Adolf Hitler

  12. pedro says:

    Here’s another piece of irony: A liberul being a hypocrite. Behold Danny Glover.

    Takes money from a corrupt politician to make a movie and he keeps it for himself all the while talking about corruption in Haiti.

    “But when will we see this directorial debut? In 2006, Glover assembled a cast including Wesley Snipes, Angela Bassett, Chiwetel Ejiofor and Mos Def, and planned to shoot his film in South Africa and Venezuela, thanks to $18m (£11m) from one of Glover’s heroes, Venezuelan president Hugo Chávez. Six years on, filming has not started. “We’ll get the film done,” says Glover. “We came so close so many times, you could almost taste it, man. We came that close and we’re going to do it.””

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2012/may/18/danny-glover-good-cop

  13. Egon Ruuda says:

    You all took this wrong. Yes he is a hypocrite but the fact stands Snowden should be a given a fair trial, even if it is possible in “common law” courts in the US nowadays.

    In code civil countries he would have been tried and released within days, unless some new evidence were to come up. And then he would face DP or LIWPOP

    • Dallas says:

      He knows he’s guilty. Otherwise he would have returned by now to face court under watchful eyes.

      This guy is a thrill seeker who was inspired by Assange. It’s the equivalent of copycat, celebrity seeking murderers.

      • pedro says:

        He might not know it. He’s in denial, just like you.

        • Dallas says:

          Shouldn’t you be laying roof tiles somewhere?

          • pedro says:

            You lay tiles for a living and want to make al believe it’s me. Thanks for demonstrating your denial in a broader manner.

      • Tim says:

        Bullshit, Dallas. The court system in this country is a very, very sick joke — The Department of Just Us is not there for the common man save as a tenuous illusion to be maintained by pomp and bureaucracy.

        The real truth is, they are murdering, thieving, lying bastards suffocating anything ‘just’ when it serves them.

        • Mextli says:

          ” The Department of Just Us ”

          Excellent name for it.

        • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

          You two do realize there are many FUNDAMENTAL differences between the Department of Justice and the US Court System?

          You post as if you don’t know what you are talking about….. at all.

          Amusing.

          • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

            Ah Crap. What a perfect time to debut my new nom de flame: bobbo, the non-conflating non-dogmatic existential icon defiling cynosure

            …… but I suspect the occasion to implement will arise again…..

          • Mextli says:

            Glad I could amuse. Thank you for your comments they are always welcome. The ease with which you correct others must be the product of years of training in science.

          • bobbo, we think with words, and flower with ideas says:

            Mextli so polite he insults by way of compliments says:
            6/28/2013 at 2:20 pm

            Glad I could amuse. Thank you for your comments they are always welcome. // Thank you. You couldn’t say that without appreciating their value.

            The ease with which you correct others must be the product of years of training in science. /// Not science–I just read a lot and when I come across a word I don’t know, I look it up and try to remember it. Words have power and selecting the “right word” is the most powerful thing you can do for “thinking right” as well. Avoid the error of conflation that occurs all too often==as in here conflating the US Court System which hears a case with the Just Us Dept that brings and tries a case. The Judge vs An Advocate. Very different things. While Science does somewhat the same thing, that being telling shit from shinola, reading and applying the DICTIONARY meaning of words is a much more humble undertaking. One that is open to us all?

            Just read!

            OTOH–I almost posted to correct my own error in lumping you in with Tim’s faulty conflating (made only by the application of haste, no doubt) as you only commented on his spoonerism. And I even appreciate the word play just as you do. I decided to wait for any reply from you hoping your wouldn’t draw attention to my error.

            And THIRDLY—I do notice your change in attitude when posting. You used to be more aggressive but have taken a turn to the subtle. It does give comfort…. all the fussing and fighting over what?…. mere words???

            Do the ideas really count?

          • Tim says:

            And, Bobbo, that is not a ‘Spoonerism’. A Spoonerian implementation of ‘Just Us’ would be the nonsensical ‘Uust Jus’ . But thank you for playing anyways — Muck Fe.

        • Dallas says:

          How un-American of you to encourage citizens to join our national defense systems for the purpose of sharing critical information to sworn enemies.

          If I were you, comrade, I would think about that as you grill your burger on July 4th. I’m virtually tearing up.

          • Tim says:

            Ohh I will, Dallas. I will be thinking of how someone who is not me had his bed-roll laid out 300 feet from his car but yet was arrested for DUI on the fourth of July. That guy had to spend thousands on a lawyer — a lawyer he pissed off because he was rude to his secretary, days in court, years for different sessions… All to get a two year sentence for the official crime of “improper lane change” in, as I said, a vehicle he was not driving. Why?? Because, upon intimidation and inquiry as to why he would not take the officer to the home owner to confirm his over-night plans his response was “because you are a cop and I’m not the one to be inviting flies to the picnic.

            I have pegged you, Dallas, as either a cop or a court clerk whom tattles upon every never’do’well that says “cha-ching” upon handing you the extortion fee.

            These holidays — the road-block weekends; Americans Who Fought and Died in Vain for Freedom Day. You should be so proud that you help us all to remember what it’s really all about, comrad.

          • pedro says:

            Dayum!

          • Dallas says:

            Tim – I don’t comprehend your diatribe nor see semblance as to why you support a fugitive criminal charged with espionage and theft. Can you rephrase?

            Also, you make an awful profiler because I’m neither a cop not clerk but admire how you went on a limb to be so darn specific !!

          • Tim says:

            A trained ‘profiler’ would be more likely to peg you as working in the Office of Personell Management; Probably the guy pretending to do a security check by calling the neighbors’ kid and asking questions about the dude next door applying for a job on some base somewhere — You get very upset and gruffy if the kid doesn’t play along and you start ranting “I’ve never been so disrespected my whole life!” to anyone who does not really care to hear about your latest pwning of your sham ‘position’ of power.

            You’re easy to spot — usually one of two black guys at H.Q. , 400 lbs. , and quite gay.

          • pedro says:

            Dayum!!!!

          • jpfitz says:

            Typical Texan reply. What info was treasonous, that our sms, emails and phone conversations were being recorded and stored?

          • pedro says:

            Tim: He already said he lays tiles for a living.

          • Tim says:

            pedro, liars lie. It is just what they do. They are employed here because they show some proficiency at doing so. We should not detract from Dullass his accomplishment — that would hurt his feelings. It’s not nice to laugh; Even if all the junk is right there in your face.

          • Tim says:

            pedro, I’m currently laying tiles myself (paverstone) and learning how to use a Dyne-pack to level the bed. The only difference between me and him is that I do not lie that I’m doing so and I don’t consider being a prick as a nessecary part of the job description.

          • Dallas says:

            You two need to keep your flirting on GrindR. This is not a hookup site

          • pedro says:

            This is not a site to do stupid things like contradicting yourself over & over yet… here you are!

  14. bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

    The Personality of Snowden is IRRELEVANT.

    STOP THE BULLSHIT!

  15. bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

    Tim nearly demonstrating he can post other than as a raving asshole says:
    6/28/2013 at 10:55 am

    Well, I do have lucid moments of clarity from time to time when I’m not busy liking turtles or staring at my hand or the sky (and seeing the same thing) and thinking aloud *pretty*. /// The power of allusion. I am sparking myself on about 5 different tangents. All of infinite grave and beauty to myself… of no interest to anyone else. Revelations are like that.

    Other than that, I call it the ‘hemp repression model’ and my view of the world has proved to be a working one as far as prediction goes — /// More tangents but closer. Yes, the hemp can save the world is right out of the 60′s. Good times. Still a good touchstone today. Link is to how Haiti could benefit from bamboo (and hemp should always be read into such articles):
    http://gizmag.com/bamboo-lakou-john-naylor/28079/?utm_source=Gizmag+Subscribers&utm_campaign=1ca29fcaee-UA-2235360-4&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_65b67362bd-1ca29fcaee-89824278

    Is that not the test of any model; That it’s verified after many forecasts of future events prove to be correct? /// Yep==THAT is science baby!! Something Marc needs to more closely embrace.

    That is something *climate* models lack, might I digress. /// How so? I can think of 5-6 predictions off the top of my head that are coming true. Until you specify your error, I will assume you confuse weather with climate or individual variation with the general trend. Unusual for hemp advocates to present with such an infarction.

    In this case, this country has taken us all to hell in the name of Rayon, Dacron, and Nylon to win against the evil other hemp which does not need big oil, big pharma, big monsanto. /// Yep==it will take a religion based on Green/Mother Earth/Nature/Gaia to spend more money and avoid the evil of petrochemicals. We are already past the tipping point for voluntary action to avoid these consequences. I look for a revolution, but revolution or not===it won’t be pretty.

    What is that word? Antithisis? /// What is that? You are against throwing hissy fits… or lisping?? Doens’t seem relevant. I can think of several Anti’s that apply. I’m kinda an Anti guy. I’m very pro anti.

    I never noticed that particular light-beam coming out of that follicule on my left hand before…. /// cataracts.

    • Tim says:

      Shoally Hit, bobbo; That’s one yell of a hurl about the bamboo. Thx for the link, it’s bookmarked. I have a different but related plant I like to advocate for our particular climatic zone — River cane. I submit that I’ve seen a ‘cane-break’ which is a 10 foot deep x 10 foot high x 50 ft. long growth of, well, river cane save many a soul {on one particular day, at least — I guess it’s just kind of ‘antecdotal’ for you}

      In the shadow of this ‘cane-break’ were spared a shanty-shack, an old silver-streak trailor, a small boat, and two damned-dirty humans. Outside that boundary but within the 600 ft. wide area of interest were lost some twenty souls all drowned in ponds, torn in half, tangled up in barbed wire — twenty-two, if you count hoomans.

      It’s a damned shame here that more people can not put that observation to use but all these pretentious cookie-cutter houses and all the flat fucking bermuda grass lawns as far as the remote-sensors can detect are bound to ‘grass’ that is less than three inches tall. They are slaves to worthless grass and can’t take precautions and grow a plant in the yard to protect them from the fate they witnessed of their far-flung neighbors.

      It’s the bankers and realtors, you see? You’ve got to die early slaving along on worthless shit that must be kept looking nice for when it’s time for them to ‘turn it over’ to the next slaves.

      Cataracts. Hmm. I hadn’t considered that, thx.

      • bobbo, we think with words, and flower with ideas says:

        Well, I thought spoonerism was broad enough to include the homophonic at issue and considered saying malapropism but without resorting to the dictionary (my great fault) I thought malaprop had an “unintentional” element…not giving honor to the intentional word play self evident. Pun was wrong…but indeed I had to look up spoonerism on your good counsel. I look further and did not quickly find any word play definition that fully captures “Just Us.” Uniquely, it turns one word into two, changes the meaning, and is intentional. Perhaps pun does come close?

        Isn’t bamboo much more functional than River Cane==greater natural habitat, less water, more uses?

        I love bamboo. Beautiful grass.

        • Tim says:

          We like words; Don’t we, bobbo? With their tight little consonants stretched seductively thin around those bulbous vowel regions?

          I don’t know what the proper Linnaean pidgeon-holeing would be for such ‘word play.’ For me, it is an intentional perversion of the title to reflect the true nature of the perverted system itself. — It’s weighted against individuals, individual thought or action, indeed, it’s weighted against righteousness itself. Funny thing that it just naturally rolls so easily off the tounge like that (cosmic justice?).

          The bitch with the scales may be blind but her measure is rigged and she’s got a dongle in her ear listinging to a shit coaching her along.

          • bobbo, we think with words, and flower with ideas says:

            This might even be relevant but Lady Justice is not blind==but blindfolded. I think that actually adds to whatever nefarious motives/conclusions one might draw. She is pretending or posing to be something she is not.

            Criticism is too easy and by and large is a meaningless exercise UNTIL one can suggest an alternative. An alternative that cannot be instantly thrown out as specious. The fact that all relevant solutions involve people throws out 99% of otherwise good ideas.

            …… you had me at bulbous. Serendipitously, almost another plant reference?

        • Tim says:

          bobbo has picked up a piece of profound and slapped me with it.

          *Lady Justice is not blind==but blindfolded*

          Hmm… In captivity, probably under duress…. …

          Judicial ‘Stockholme Syndrome’? or just Inverse Dominatrix; Boing!

        • Tim says:

          It seems this posting has finally tuckered out so that I may leave my sorry confession of my favorite ‘spoonerism’ without the embarrassment of having anyone actually see it.

          It would be the reversed initial consonants of *butter fly* in which the spoonerism itself is a more apt description of that impossible and insipid beast:

          *flutter by*

      • jpfitz says:

        Our love, well not mine, of lawns have to do with a false impression of wealth and health. As far as I’m concerned lawns are deserts doing nothing except spewing noise pollution and of course CO2 and other pollution.

        “A 2001 study showed that some mowers produce the same amount of pollution (emissions other than carbon dioxide) in one hour as driving a 1992 model vehicle for 650 miles (1,050 km).[21] Another estimate puts the amount of pollution from a lawn mower at four times the amount from a car, per hour, although this report is no longer available.”

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawn_mower#Gasoline_.28petrol.29

        • bobbo, we think with words, and flower with ideas says:

          jp==welcome back… too long gone===but shake out the cobwebs. No body is talking lawns.

          • Tim says:

            *Lady Justice is not blind==but blindfolded*

            Damn, bobbo; That is kind of profound. Let me drunken-sleep on that one.

            And, because the threading of this blog is just a little bit confused, let me steal this space to reply to jpfitz and say “green desert” they is.

          • Tim says:

            *…you had me at bulbous…*

            Oh, God! If you’re wanting to ‘spring forth’ with something upon me then just keep it on freerepublic, will yas?

          • jpfitz says:

            Hello back…I did stray from the; what was the subject? I don’t feel like hitting page up. I despise lawns. We need more meadows and trees. My neighbor cut down three 40 year old trees. Tim’s comment just struck a nerve.

        • Tim says:

          I bet nobody will get a tax credit for not mowing the shit, though.

          • jpfitz says:

            Yea, then my property value will lower. You keep it green and mind them weeds! /sarcasm off

            I plant many flowers for the pollinators.

  16. bobbo, we think with words, and flower with ideas says:

    Dallas surprising me says:
    6/29/2013 at 6:24 am

    Tim – I don’t comprehend your diatribe nor see semblance as to why you support a fugitive criminal charged with espionage and theft. Can you rephrase? /// Dallas–why are you “in line” with the same power structure that is anti-gay, anti-democratic, anti-privacy, anti-women’s right to choose, intrusive, secretive, lying to Congress and the Pulbic…. and so forth?? I find myself a bit in the middle. I don’t praise Snowden, but I don’t condemn him either. The need to follow the law vs the superceding better service to society. Secrecy in the name of National Security vs Openness/Democracy/Transparency. All these issues are not so black and white so as to cause us all to don Team Colors and start fighting? Seems to me a bit more TIME needs to be added to the stew and see how the issues marinate? Why should anyone “suspect” the gubment on issues from A to Z and then think for some reason they have it right on Snowden/National Data Collection/Massive Secret Program that 20 years ago would have been illegal AND MORE CONCERNING—UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

    Thinking People……. should.

    Also, you make an awful profiler because I’m neither a cop not clerk but admire how you went on a limb to be so darn specific !! //That is admirable and I chuckle too. What are the odds that a few casual observations can allow one to devine such detail?……….. Comes from too much tv watching and wanting to get into Lucy Lui’s pants–a situation you cannot be charged with.

    Its good to laugh.

    • Dallas says:

      “..Dallas–why are you “in line” with the same power structure that is anti-gay, anti-democratic, anti-privacy..”

      Well, I respond and react to individual issues because I’m not a party sheep. Snowden is a traitor and fugitive criminal by any measure.

      What little credit I give him for (seemingly) “having a conscience about privacy”, it gets totally overshadowed by what he did in violating his terms for being entrusted with national security information.

      Imagine if we allow ANY military, CIA, NSA worker schmuck to independently select what he/she finds “offensive” and goes public with it. Sorry, that won’t work.

      The “whistle blower” hairball excuse fails the first test – is it illegal?

      Shame on you Bobbo for shaming your good name.

      • pedro says:

        “Well, I respond and react to individual issues because I’m not a party sheep.”

        Joke of the decade!!!!

      • Tim says:

        Go for it, kiddos; Join the services and get a nice education. Play with the pretty play-things for awhile, and then leave, bringing out the information to the sworn enemies {especially technical countermeasures to devices and instrumentation} because, by demonstration, those enemies are the american people; A much maligned group of which I happen to be a member.

      • Tim says:

        def Dallas: Aj, squared-away, jarhead gobot that makes very,very bad flawed morality-based decisions when he’s separated from his handlers.

  17. bobbo, the iconoclastic non-conflating non-dogmatic existential Idol defiling cynosure says:

    Respecting Dallas’s humanity, common sense, and care for those oppressed by those interests that be should be considered closely as he says:
    6/30/2013 at 1:43 pm

    “..Dallas–why are you “in line” with the same power structure that is anti-gay, anti-democratic, anti-privacy..”

    Well, I respond and react to individual issues because I’m not a party sheep. Snowden is a traitor and fugitive criminal by any measure. /// Well….not by “any” measure. THAT is the issue afterall that provides him with spotty support and a claim for immunity. Do a thought experiement: imagine there are “no laws” and the gubment does as it is and Snowden did as he did. Where does your MORAL compass point now? I imagine that in a vacuum of law, most people do not want to be tracked, spindled, folded, mutilated and filed? Perhaps my imagination is too broad? But shirley–absent “the law” your opinion of the moral issues will change somewhat? Its that somewhat that needs to be evaluated more carefully.

    What little credit I give him for (seemingly) “having a conscience about privacy”, it gets totally overshadowed by what he did in violating his terms for being entrusted with national security information. /// Again, the law aside and you do have your finger weakly on the somewhat==what did Snowden do except speak the truth? What has the government done but lie and keep secrets? That is a strong starting position to evaluate the equities involved.

    Imagine if we allow ANY military, CIA, NSA worker schmuck to independently select what he/she finds “offensive” and goes public with it. Sorry, that won’t work. /// Ahhhh—well done. Very close to my own conundrum…and the benefit of this forum: answering you clarifies my own thinking: when dealing with Snowden, especially in the context of criminal charges, we are NOT dealing with the systemic issues that are also strongly overlapping and raised. One of the Best Books ever Written: Billy Budd. Must we sacrifice the innocent for the good of society? Short book. Easy reading. Movie very consistent with the book.

    The “whistle blower” hairball excuse fails the first test – is it illegal? /// Well, it is illegal if the secrecy violated the Constitutional right of privacy, due process, and so forth. Further, it is Snowdens blowing that has outted gubment officials lying to We the People and Congress in public testimony. How is that stopped if all those who know the truth are muzzled? But the real balance I think is that once again you are kowtowing to the “legal” definition of whistle blower. Just expand it to those things that the public should know? The most important social changes have always ever come from violating the law. Our own Civil War is a good example of that. What are you going to do when Slavery is legal?

    Shame on you Bobbo for shaming your good name. /// no….still using the small case “b.”

    Context===when we unknowingly and subconsciously choose it, we have given 99% of our answer before thinking about the subject.

    amusing.

  18. Tim says:

    Hear! Hear! Shirley, please.