Michael Dowd – or Reverend Reality – says Reality is the new God, Science is the new Bible. And it’s time for the religious world to upgrade to the authority of evidence rather than the authority of scripture.

Reality is our God
Science is our Bible
Evidence is our Scripture
Big History is our Creation Story
Ecology it our Theology
Integrity is our Salvation
Positive Evolution is our Mission

Is Religion evolving into Science?



  1. Dave Phillips says:

    It’s about time somebody said this out loud.

  2. ± says:

    This won’t sit well with people who would rather believe in an invisible-omnipotent-omnipresent-omniscient-friend-in-the-sky.

  3. Mextli says:

    bobbo is that you?

  4. bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

    Is that me? I don’t know, I’m gonna post before I listen.

    “Is Religion evolving into Science?” /// No, that is not what religion does. Religion is just a big pile of steaming BS. All it does is rot.

    My indication, if not proof: Mark–aren’t you a parishioner if not a pastor if not a Deacon of this movement? ………………… How then your anti-AGW position and your complete confusion over what cause and effect is regarding the Permian Extinction? or even what co2 being a green house gas means?

    Religion. It befuddles the mind calling for faith even while spelling out for evidence. All too much like proclaiming peace while killing the infidel.

    No. I say regarding religion: Fie!! Yes, I say FIE!!!—Away with your silliness.

    I am a Man of Science. I will believe/use science until a better system comes along. Religion will never become science, BUT, as I have posted a few times, maybe Worship of the Environment and Future Generations can become a religion. Heavily influenced by Science, but only a small part of it. After all, how much reality can a religiously bent mind handle?

    • Tim says:

      When ‘State’ and ‘Science’ get together, you get policy like eugenics… carry on, I won’t have to wrack my brain to reply to you much longer, I suspect..

      Alex Jones had this quote yesterday…

      “” No man escapes when freedom fails, the best men rot in filthy jails. And those who cried,”appease appease” are hung by those they tried to please. — anonymous, circa 1750

      • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

        Oh Timmy—so close. Science is like a gun: just a tool. When state and science get together, you get eugenics, you get cures for diseases, you get expanded civilization and life spans, you get good and bad and the tools to choose between them.

        I am PRO Eugenics…. but all as personally chosen free from any mandates from the State.

        SCIENCE is NOT “what” you choose. Its what you use to achieve what you have chosen. Choices are made by politics intertwined with religion. Good old Supremes just yesterday saying Town Counsels could start meetings with a prayer to our Lord. Good old Conservative Supreme Court: most activist court in 70 years–overturning every precedent set.

        Drum beats.

        • Tim says:

          “”you get cures for diseases

          Really? Because, in my observations, you may sometimes get antibiotics as a ‘cure’ but only to keep you alive longer to milk…

          breast cancer. They always want to march for the cure, never the cause… fits with just about everything.

          I heard this really sad caller a couple nights ago on GroundZero… Couldn’t even countenance that Algor lied about anything… Believes Earth is dead over co2.. never mind genetic pollution/chemical assault over huge areas, true believers should see my ‘appease’ comment above.

          • bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

            Tim engorged on conspiracy radio and ready to releave himself says:
            5/8/2014 at 12:23 pm

            “”you get cures for diseases

            Really? /// Yes, of course. Measles, Polio, Dengue… a whole scourge of biblical rewards conquered….. for the time being.

            Because, in my observations, you may sometimes get antibiotics as a ‘cure’ but only to keep you alive longer to milk…breast cancer. /// No cure without eternal life huh? Silly boy. Buy a dictionary.

            They always want to march for the cure, never the cause… fits with just about everything. /// Mighty slim distinction you make there. If you even understand it. YES…like every other person on earth, I will take a cure, even if the cause remains unknown. Just like accepting religion?

            I heard this really sad caller a couple nights ago on GroundZero… Couldn’t even countenance that Algor lied about anything… Believes Earth is dead over co2.. /// Earth will go on another 5 Billion years. Most likely, without humans. Big Brains and Lizard emotions just doesn’t work over the long term.

            never mind genetic pollution//// What example do you have in mind? GMO? Breeding? Some good, some bad. Its hoomans afterall. Like god smiting the Earth with a flood: starting over.

            chemical assault over huge areas, /// Thats true. Growing dead zones in the ocean due to Carbon runoff necessary to grow enough food to feed us all. See the trend lines?===> Its science.

            true believers should see my ‘appease’ comment above. /// How so? Who was being appeased over what? Given the time frame, sounds like kowtowing to the Holy Inquisition?

            What is god except the worst tyrant possible of conception? Love ain’t no excuse.

    • The letters t, d and r are NOT your gods! says:

      That’s quite interesting what you said.

      “Is Religion evolving into Science?” /// No, that is not what religion does. Religion is just a big pile of steaming BS. All it does is rot.

      Based on that statement alone, I agree!

      Perhaps even more poignant might be in the realization that every single religion in existence continues to crush individual freedoms (either subtlety or outright) whenever it successfully gets it’s parishioners to believe in something based on nothing but that same pile of BS.

      So you may want to look up the word Religion since it does seem that YOU may be simply praying to a DIFFERENT GOD! And in your case, the religious symbol does seem to be that of a JACKASS!

      • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

        Please copy and paste my prayer, or allusion to it. From my own biased view, as close as i can get to one is following the scientific PROCESS to whatever it reveals and then is challenged and changed later by another scientific process.

        TAKE BACK what you said!===== or, I’m a gonna just have to HATE you…. and what you said. Its guilt by association. Rather god like don’t you think?

        Silly posers.

  5. pedro says:

    Good to know science results are to be believed, not known

  6. BigBoyBC says:

    “Is Religion evolving into Science?”

    No, Science is evolving into Religion.

    Atheists are out there proselytizing their so called “Non-beliefs” and attacking those who do “believe”

    So-called “men of science” are saying, “don’t question them, they’re Scientists, you denier…”

    Congratulations! You’ve turned science into what you despise the most, A Religion!!

    • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

      No scientist ever says don’t question them. They manage their own time so as not to waste it. You are free to do as you will—like project your own BS onto others.

      Silly Hooman.

      • BigBoyBC says:

        Climate scientist do, have and continue to…

        • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

          Find any quote you will. I’ll bet they simply say they have better things to do than waste their time arguing with fools. (OY!!)).

          The Science IS SETTLED.

          You won’t find Scientists arguing with fools about evolution either.

          But every Sunday===churches are full of fools exercising their freedom and lack of education to argue as they will.

          Can you see the difference? Your FREEEEEEDOM to be ignorant is not directly impinged by scientists refusing to pick up the tambourine.

          Yea, verily!

          • Tim says:

            “”The Science IS SETTLED

            Oh, really??

            is it
            Antropgenic Global Warming
            Abrupt Climate Change
            or Global Climate Disruption

            where every pleb will hear the weatherspokeshole say how many degrees above or below average it is every day and proceed to flip out??

          • bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

            Yes really. Your three terms all mean the same thing. The label simply stressing some aspect of the effect of increasing the level of co2 in our atmosphere.

            Unfortunately, people will start to flip out en masse sufficient to change the outcome (sic!) only after it is too late.

            Thats what the Science is settled on. But even the scientists are only hooman. They all too humanly accept their pay checks and don’t want to come off as alarmists=====>which is exactly what all of them should be doing right now…………because ……… we are all doomed.

            Dying in our own excrement.

            I hate it when that happens.

  7. bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

    Reality is our God /// Existentialism: reality is a human created value and doesn’t exist in any other meaningful sense.

    Science is our Bible /// Too easy to cling to old theories. Science is a process not a set of beliefs. There is more “truth” in what is not yet known calling for all that we do know to be modified if not over thrown. Science and Religion: not a good fit. Only a Procrustean Bed.

    Evidence is our Scripture /// Evidence including of our subjective experience? I suppose that is “definitional” but in Science before it was subverted by Religion, subjectivity was not part of “science” at all. Science is all “objective” what can be shared/confirmed by others. But I am not a solipsist. I would footnote the idea though.

    Big History is our Creation Story /// I think Big History is a form of social science not to be confused with Physics or Astro Physics…. but ok. ((Life springs from non-life. We are actually “related” to rocks. Of course, all life is related.))

    Ecology it our Theology //// 4.03: Kneejerk reaction to “The future is real” but became a convert when he said “If we don’t believe in the future, we condemn it.” Yea verily. Thats what AGW is all about. I’d say Ecololgy is our Absolution. The world is over populated, our coming into being is a sin. How to correct for it? Ecology.

    Integrity is our Salvation //// There is no salvation, in the end, we all die. No after life. Every thing turning into dust.
    Positive Evolution is our Mission

    • Tim says:

      “”our coming into being is a sin.

      Wow. That is at odds with —

      “”and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. –Genesis 1:28

      • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

        Well Timmy….. what took you so long? Or is Poe’s Law in operation????

        Takes an atheist to explain their own religion to them: yes, being born is a sin, the consequence of Adams violation of Gods will for which we all need salvation.

        But, being born into an already over populated world is part of the Church of Reality where “Ecology is our Theology.” Doesn’t have anything to do with CHRISTIAN religion.

        Its called switching the context. Try again.

        • Tim says:

          “”Ecology is our Theology

          “”For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator,… — Romans 1:25

          • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

            You are starting to get it.

            Will it be Science or Religion?

  8. bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

    Mazzy Star: Into Dust: https://youtube.com/watch?v=m1luu2eFD4w

    Positive Evolution is our Mission /// Good luck with that. Hard to imagine too much tinkering not having those unexpected consequences: T-Rex running all over the place. Saw a good show the other day. Lots of people getting sick/infirmed because they have no parasites in their blood/organs. Like our gut flora, we humans are as more a community of organisms than we are solely one set of chromosomes. Without bacteria: we would die.

    My mantra: all the dots are connected. Erase those you will with caution…… KNOWING at some point the cascade will ignite.

    …………………………..”and so it goes.”

  9. bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

    Some good ideas, worth listening to, but Science is not Religion. Two different mind sets/emotions, two different magisteria.

    Shows the limitation of ALL metaphors: at some point they break down. Does the parallel construction demonstrate more than it hides/confuses?

    Religion is more about the mindset that wants the truth to be simple, unchanging, delivered. Science is about contesting the status quo, accepting the best evidence, finding out.

    X’s and O’s.

    Mind the gap.

    • Tim says:

      “”Science is about contesting the status quo

      Yea. You should try it sometime.

      So, you’re an adrenaline junkie, like Columbus??

      • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

        Timmmmmay starting to scare me real bad says:
        5/8/2014 at 12:16 pm

        “”Science is about contesting the status quo /// Yea verily….. what else?

        Yea. You should try it sometime. //// I do constantly. Like this very thread for instance. do you have eyes but cannot see???? ((Join Pedro!))

        So, you’re an adrenaline junkie, like Columbus?? //// I suppose adrenaline plays some role in pleasure? Skiing, sky diving, flying, scuba, hiking, nature photography, sex, playing pool in strange bars, betting strangers, Judo Competitions, dart throwing, archery but I’ve never been a fan of adrenaline itself. I don’t think of Columbus as an Adrenaline Junkie. More of a 17th Century Christian asshole? Is that the same thing?

        • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

          17th Cent?

          Ha, ha.

          • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

            So much for Big History! Heeeeeeeelp meeeeeee. My Big Brain has started shrinking………………

            Too soon and violet: we have religion!

            Have you read Proverbs recently? “A fool gives full vent to his spirit, but a wise man quietly holds it back.”

            Oy!

          • Tim says:

            “”Have you read Proverbs recently?

            Not so much… I have an aversion to certain ethnic/politically flavored writings — I used to dowel, glue, and sand cabinate faceplates. My employment was cut short by rival kikes in the synagogue after he pitched a fit and threw out the bankers.

          • bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

            Faint whiff of antisemitism coming from you again. Can always be taken two ways at least, but “best” to be avoided??

            I’ve never understood why Christians aren’t Jews. Thats the religion chosen by Jesus.

            Seems obvious to me.

          • Tim says:

            “”Faint whiff of antisemitism coming from you again

            Yea, I probably shouldn’t have married the bitch — she does not shave her muff that often.

          • bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

            Yep, Jesus didn’t do that. Marry women that is. ……………. and we’re back to original sin.

            Misogynist religion. “Slaves obey your Masters.”

            Just as any tyrant would have it, afterall, cannot put too strong a light on one’s own hypocrisy.

            So…… we get the smell off the fish…. how?

        • Tim says:

          “”17th Century Christian asshole?

          **Upon his return to Spain after his third voyage, Columbus was imprisoned for the barbaric acts of torture he had used to govern Hispaniola. He and a few of his men were jailed for six weeks until King Ferdinand ordered their release. Columbus’s freedom and wealth were restored, and the crown agreed to fund his fourth voyage.

          Funny that, in school, I always heard that he was imprisioned for proving Earth was not flat… I’m probably thinking of countless other ‘miscreants’ thousands of years before him, though.

          • bobbo, Big Brained Apes with Lizard Emotions is an Evolutionary Dead End says:

            Yes, he thought he had “dominion” over anything he came across that wasn’t already stolen by other Christian Kings.

          • Tim says:

            “”Yes, he thought he had “dominion”

            Fair enough.
            That is usually how State-sponsored atrocities are stomached out to ‘the people’.

          • bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

            When State and Religion are one, how do you parse the responsibilities?

          • Tim says:

            “”When State and Religion are one

            You tell me. You seem to have a leg up on the agender…
            http://infowars.com/ecoscience-pdf-john-holdren-really-did-say-those-things/

            As an aside, did anyone see that the woman who filmed her abortion as a beautiful thing is an horror movie actress?? — Specifically, she was in a film as a butcher of children. It is the true sadistic psychopath that keeps mementos of the victims. As a scientist, you keep all your conquests in formaldahyde, right??

          • bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

            I think its called: “a relic.”

  10. bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

    I used the term “hate” above. Humorously as always but even strongly held beliefs remind me of this following skit by Monty Python. I thought it was anti Germans, but turns out it is anti Commies. A timely update?

    https://youtube.com/watch?v=MoATWN68IZA

    Can we balance our strongly held beliefs?

    • Tim says:

      I meant to reply to that the other day but, yes. You managed to find a clip I had forgotten even though it was buried in one of two ‘on location’ shoots of the Flying Circus which contain a couple of my favorite sub-skits —

      “”That tomato has just ejected itself…
      and
      “”…No dear, this is the dream; You’re still back in the cell…

      Ha! In that one, the guy had a bicycle accident and thought he was Ethel Murman afterwards. Funny thing, that; The Ruskies thought so too!!

      https://youtube.com/watch?v=zYV-qYeWPkk

      I think the only other ‘on location’ shoots including Carol Cleveland was the one where they went on an expidition to find a brontosaurus in some old lady’s basement. That one always made me want to make a basement into a swimming maze.

      • bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

        On Location? Often “at the beach.” Some London sidewalk sketches. But yeah, especially back then, studio shooting was much easier and cheaper.

        So many good routines. Very few very bad ones although I did not like Gilliams cartoons very much. Still don’t. He’s a much better director although I have watched Brazil 2-3 times and can’t get into it.

        I do laugh at the several sketches asking philosophers what the rugby score was. I think that on all the tv quiz shows where I’m at $500K and the question is “What blue jeans first came out with a button fly?” “In what car did Britney first show her crotch?”

        I never get those right. Got to rely on the audience.

    • IM75 says:

      “Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning”

      https://google.com/search?q=%22CO2+scam%22&btnG=Search

      • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

        Oh gee whiz IM. Any anti-science google search that turns up ONLY 2000 hits is by definition speaking only to the loons.

        Your post supports the position I have taken on this thread………. or do you “think” otherwise?

        Ha, ha. This is like taking candy from Pedro.

        • IM75 says:

          Anti-science eh? Ha! That’s a good one. I’ve been a scientist for the last 57 years but I’m not going to pull rank on you and show how profoundly wrong your statements are. I’d definitely like to be around some day after you’ve woken up though.

          Be sure to make some ignorant statement now about my contextual use of “pulling rank”

      • Tim says:

        Global Warming or Global Governance?
        http://youtube.com/watch?v=_u81qXOYfKg

  11. bobbo, given the lag time, Hooman Civilization has already killed itself off with co2 poisoning. The Earth will continue, still an open question as to with or without us. We had our chance, Big Brains and all says:

    On topic, here’s some reality for you:

    “One of the 6 Biggest Ecological Disasters in the last 4.5 Billion Years is Happening Right Now”

    http://wired.com/2014/05/one-of-the-6-biggest-ecological-disasters-in-the-last-4-5-billion-years-is-happening-right-now/

    Elizabeth Warren repeated last week: if we burn up more than 30% of the known coal/oil reserves we have already established WE WILL DESTROY THE EARTH FOR HUMAN HABITATION.

    ie–absolutely no reason to spend money on further exploration, or polluting the Poles, the Northern Pole newly exposed due to global warming—which isn’t true because the South Pole has more Ice?

    Silly Hoomans.

    350ppm was the tipping point. We are at 400 now, and accelerating to 450 and higher.

    ………………Total self caused annihilating. Does sound sci-fi-ish doesn’t it? Already been TV shows on what EXTREME measures can be taken to reverse AGW like putting aluminum foil over Greenland sort of thing.

    What will Science suggest when our ass is half in the tank and the flush has started? I’ve said nuclear bombs in the Sahara to blast dust into the atmosphere. Would it “work?” Work meaning saving the human species. AGAIN==our society is already killed. Lag time: we just haven’t fallen over yet.

    Grisly.

    But thems the facts. Enjoy.

    • Tim says:

      bobbo, I don’t think you get it yet. Earth is not permanent. If the species is to outlive it then they must move out. If you want us to go deeper into serfdom so that algor can continue to stomp your neighborhood flat with his ‘carbon footprint’ then you serve what you hate — You have empowered the rich/evil class to carry on.

      It’s time to cast forth our wad to the stars {or, maybe just the inner planets and moons of jupiter, for now} but this stifling of human activity with taxation and regulation will only continue the stagnation — They don’t give a shit about you, me, humanity, destiny. If you want to step back a few hundred years so that all your fealty is to the king to allow you to grow a turnip then you are part of what really doomed humanity.

      I noticed that with The Last Half-Black President, he beamed with delight that the oil industry is backing the catostaphic global climate disruption mantra. Care to take a guess why?? They will pass this tax onto you as an ‘indulgence’ you must pay for the ‘sin’ of living here… The corporations get what they’ve always wanted and you’re cheering them on. Stop that.

      Do you really think that a group of criminals calling themselves ‘government’ which continuously, intentionally poisons the populace and the environment gives a shit about a 2 ft. rise of the sea??

      And the desert tortise?? Please… They still test nukes out there.

      • Tim says:

        “”It’s time to cast forth our wad to the stars

        Personally, I have a hard time hitting the mirror, these days — It was just a suggestion…

  12. pedro says:

    And the bobbo manic show carries on

  13. bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

    Timmy confusing bobbo with Politics or Religion says:
    5/8/2014 at 2:46 pm

    bobbo, I don’t think you get it yet. /// I’m here to learn but must it be either or?

    Earth is not permanent. /// correct.

    If the species is to outlive it then they must move out. /// That is a “long term” challenge of another 2-3 Billion years before our Sun goes Red Giant in 5 Billion. The issue TODAY is hoomans causing our own extinction in the next 2-300 years. Do the math. See the difference?……. Focus.

    If you want us to go deeper into serfdom so that algor can continue to stomp your neighborhood flat with his ‘carbon footprint’ then you serve what you hate — You have empowered the rich/evil class to carry on. //// Algore is about solutions. We don’t need to go there when in USA we don’t even agree there is a problem. THAT IS WHY ObomaGod’s decision on the Pipeline will be CATALYZING==one way or the other, either way. We will be witnesses to Big History. Right in our Faces. ……………. sublime.

    It’s time to cast forth our wad to the stars {or, maybe just the inner planets and moons of jupiter, for now} //// Grow up. We are stuck on earth. Robots a slight ripple. Time/distance/energy—real world limitations on our realtiy. Religious magical thinking otherwise. I say: FIE! Be a man of Science.

    but this stifling of human activity with taxation and regulation will only continue the stagnation /// We got to the moon/space by a tax support gubment program. Can’t happen any other way. Space is not a for profit enterprise. Deal with it.

    — They don’t give a shit about you, me, humanity, destiny. If you want to step back a few hundred years so that all your fealty is to the king to allow you to grow a turnip then you are part of what really doomed humanity. /// Hard to follow, but I get a feeling you are wrong. Its burning coal that is going to kill us, not growing turnips organically. Can’t juggle can you Timmy.

    I noticed that with The Last Half-Black President, he beamed with delight that the oil industry is backing the catostaphic global climate disruption mantra. Care to take a guess why?? They will pass this tax onto you as an ‘indulgence’ you must pay for the ‘sin’ of living here… The corporations get what they’ve always wanted and you’re cheering them on. Stop that. //// What he and you are babbling about, a tax won’t do it. Too far down the road, that road being populated with 7 going to 11 Billion people when it is only a two way walking path meant for …. pick your own minimum number. Reality is a Bitch. I hate it, I HATE IT…………. ooooooh I hate it ….. Arggggggggh!!!!!!!!

    Do you really think that a group of criminals calling themselves ‘government’ which continuously, intentionally poisons the populace and the environment gives a shit about a 2 ft. rise of the sea?? /// 2 feet we could take. Its 20 feet in 100 years. See the issues yet? but you are inching closer. Perhaps facing backwards, but still inching closer. You want to complain about Nanny Gubment?======> Wait till they deny the Pipeline and impose a tax meant to fund green alternatives to a degree THAT IT HURTS!!!!!! Thats what it is going to take, it there is time.

    And the desert tortise?? Please… They still test nukes out there. /// Turtle parts work for me.
    Reply /// I did.

    • IM75 says:

      “Space is not a for profit enterprise. Deal with it.”

      It’s going to be interesting to see how you deal with it when I feed you back a bunch of quotes of things you’ve said over the years some day.

    • Tim says:

      “”We are stuck on earth.

      For the vast majority of us, I agree. But, I suspect there are habitations scattered throughout our system — Those elusive non-terrestrial officers… We’ll probably never know.

      “”We got to the moon/space by a tax support gubment program. Can’t happen any other way.

      Yes, though there are some who considered the moonshot effort to be nothing more than another ‘pyramid scheme’. That is to say that when populaces begin expressing discontent with the system then it’s time to put them to work on some monumental project. I have no doubt man has been to the moon. I’m just not sure that what we were shown on television in the sixties was the real deal; I suspect the Russians beat us there years earlier.

      But what if there was another way?? Imagine technology that allows individuals to effortlessly glide the firmament and return as easily as a drive to Walmart. I maintain, if that were the case, that it would be outlawed — too empowering for the individual.

      ^^{{i’m having a bit of writer’s block, at the moment. But I wanted to relate that ‘too empowering for the indvidual’ is why cannabis was banned worldwide. Just limiting the scope to renewable natural rescources, biomass from hemp would sure have supplanted much oil and the wars to secure that supply of ‘raw material’. The *Green Alternative* was outlawed. Also, in a biomass economy, ‘property tax’ is literally grown on your land. Those who truely live ‘off-grid’ are usually persecuted for it if not outright imprisioned or otherwise displaced from their land.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor_Wears_No_Clothes

      Surprize, suprise! All of a sudden smoking pot doesn’t make timmy grow tits and dismember mommy anymore so long as he’s paying a ‘carbon tax’, a tax on life.

      “”Space is not a for profit enterprise.

      Why not? Lots of raw materials with {as yet undisclosed} technology that makes them easy to get at… Oh yea. I remember now. There was that Federal overreach, with all their spacegrabbing to protect E.T.

      “”…Thats what it is going to take, if there is time.

      Well, there probably isn’t but not because of co2. I’m being pretty fatalistic here myself but:

      I truely took Revelations seriously and surmized about how such a beast system would work — That is how I came to the conclustion,~1988, that it would indeed be a co2 tax. Gonna save the planet with a bureaucracy?? Well, then you better get started and quantize/index/catalog/monitor ALL life processes. I’d start spraying the whole planet with nanotech rfid…

      I’m Christian, yes. But I’ve sort of screwed myself out of that ‘sweet peace that surpasseth all understanding’ — I’ve been bitter for a very long time, fearful to. Christians are not supposed to live in fear. One promise of Christianity is ‘a new heaven and a new earth’ which is pretty much devoid of subverting dickheads.

      This is the last generation. The Kindom of Heaven is coming; Prepare to meet your God… — R.G. Stair, the voice of the last-day prophet of God

      Jacob’s Ladder
      http://youtube.com/watch?v=vvsw_Jq4UcE

  14. ± says:

    sayeth bobbo “The Science IS SETTLED.”

    bobbo, read the text at this link and grok the graphs.

    http://earthintime.com/earthintime.html

    Unless it is against your religion, the science is NOT settled at all. You have merely bought into the dogma of your preferred R/Ds. Although AGW may be true, there is no proof. And there is much reason for rational people to question it.

    There are legions of reasonable scientists who dare not go on record with the slightest whiff of dissent on this topic for fear that they will never see another research grant for the rest of their lives. You support the lie because it is not known to be true but purported as such. This is your dogma. Again you define yourself as the hoi polloi as you have many times by admitting you are an R/D.

    • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

      P/M–I am a Man of Science for the same reason I am a D/R voter: its pragmatic.

      Every single organized group of relevant scientific professionals is on record supporting AGW or is silent on the issue. The last one to finally roll over was the group of oil and gas geologists (name excapes me right now–Mickey actually provided the link) funded by Big Oil. Even they agree now.

      My proof: your link is to a single person of unknown rep and is presented with light colored ink on a black background.

      ………………..” You’ve been hypMotized!!!……….”

      Ha, ha. Always good to avoid being hypmotized! Watch for clucking at breakfast and eating cheerio’s. That and a straight pinky finger is a dead give away.

  15. IM75 says:

    JD – I’ve become painfully aware that some posts cannot be commented upon, especially it seems the ones that really NEED to be commented upon. Is that by design, or what?

    • ± says:

      IM75, you could be experiencing that you can not post past the fourth indent. I too think this is idiotic. In fact this blog would probably be way more successful if it was totally hierarchical.

      I’m not implying that anyone should care, but I would never be here again if it was a totally flat blog. So look at the good about it.

  16. bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

    Quit blaming anyone other than your HYPmOTIZED self: post where you want to.

    I just showed you how.

    Grab your “destiny.”

    ((Ha, ha.====>half a Million Hits! Must be right. Just get your ears closer!))

    https://google.com/search?q=swollen+testicals+sing&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&channel=sb

  17. bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

    Timmy—put me down as a subverting dickhead. At least you are uncomfortable knowing the end. Thats “one” and counting. It is funny/sad you demonstrate the magical thinking that prevents any real grappling with the tough choices that we are too late in making.

    Combine religion with Greed with an inherent inability to appreciate risk …………….. and you get ………………….. the end of mankind.

    Big soft Brains just don’t work.

    Silly Hoomans.

  18. Faith Based Physics says:

    Show me a picture of an alpha particle, and I ‘ll show you the shadow of an angel.

    You gotta have faith to believe in either one.

    • Tim says:

      Richard Feynman?

    • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

      Assuming what needs to be assumed: NO SCIENTIST “believes” in the Alpha particle… and they won’t until they see it, or consequences of it, its trail in the ether for fractions of a pico second etc.

      You two boys could really help your thinking if you would speak plainly without metaphors and entirely ambiguous language.

      Just as “theory” means opposite things comparing Religious Magical Thinking to Scientific Evidence Based thinking, so does the notion of “believing.”

      Silly Hoomans.

      • Dinner with Andre says:

        “You two boys could really help your thinking if you would speak plainly without metaphors and entirely ambiguous language.”

        – Said the stream of consciousness posterboy

        Dinner?

        • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

          I love the notion so much its hard for me to be insulted…. but …. logically building to a supported point is the antithesis of stream of consciousness.

          Would you agree?

          I need to watch that film again. It didn’t make an impression on me…. meaning it is somewhere in the middle? Not obnoxious but not revelatory. Easy to be the first, hard to be the second?

          Yes, I’ll watch it again: will I simply “enjoy” it?

          • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

            Downright freaky:

            https://youtube.com/watch?v=9vGpBYJ5_6E

          • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

            The written material supporting the Youtube sounds about right. I don’t remember but sounds just like a film I would not relate to: a performance artist contesting with a realist.

            Oil and Water.

            If you like Oil, more power to you, but without the water, its just a grease slick.

          • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

            11 minutes in. It is rather insufferable. Listening to some BS about gathering up 40 Jewish women who love the theater and play the horn?

            Pass the wine.

            Ha, ha….. good to see how open to BS/new ideas I was as a younger person. Not so today. We got AGW to worry about!!!!!

            “Do you agree” was about whether or not I argue to a supported point, not the definition of steam of consciousness. Don’t conflate the import of arguing from multiple sources, and having fun now and then, with steam of consciousness–a more extreme form, a more pure forum of moving degrees apart from any relevant tangent?

            Know what I mean?

      • Tim says:

        There is a distinction to be made between the physical {matter/energy} and the spiritual. As it stands now, science is constrained to observations made with physical devices and what those ‘detectors’/methods reveal..

        • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

          Yes, and when using real world evidence via the scientific method, eventually/ultimately everyone comes to agreement…. absent those who are not lost to the spiritual along the way. Hard to tell the two apart sometimes, but 99% agreeing on a proposition and 1% not is a strong clue. Not inerrant, but a pretty good clue.

          Spirit skepsism only and always produces disagreement, discord, and isolation.

          There is a clue there too. So much so that as with anti-theism, even if spiritualism was valid in some way, it would be pragmatically wise to reject it.

          Yea, verily.

          • Din Din says:

            Andre 1:32:00

          • bobbo, the pragmatic existential evangelical anti-theist says:

            Thanks for the nudge DD…. I think it started a bit earlier, say 1:29? And like every sane person, I agree with the Corsican 100%. So much so, I get a bit bored listening to his position as it is so obvious. Just as I get so irritated listening to the …… what should we call him?==the artsy guy? …. so much gibberish.

            Still… if you hold me down, I would still try to find the Pro’s and Con’s of each position and assume the most valuable insights take from both camps?

            ALWAYS—-an issue of balance, even if it 99 to 1. Makes that 1% even more important, in a non-mathematical ironical sense.

            Yep, that Corsican (sic re The Princess Bride) adopted my nom de flame and I can’t even remember anything the other guy said.

            Always a good idea to build up a tolerance to the more common poisons that are in continuous play…. or is my consciousness free floating downstream?

            I say: there is a structured point being made.

            Yea, verily.

  19. orchidcup says:

    Just before he was hanged, Saddam Hussein began to recite the Muslim testament of faith.

    “I testify that there is no god but God, and Mohammed,” he began, but he was hanged before he could say the final words, “is the messenger of God.”

    “The Government, being resolved to undertake the political and moral purification of our public life, are creating and securing the conditions necessary for a really profound revival of religious life”

    [Adolph Hitler, in a speech to the Reichstag on March 23, 1933]

    “I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator. By warding off the Jews I am fighting for the Lord’s work.”

    [Adolph Hitler, in a speech to the Reichstag, 1936]

    • Tim says:

      “”‘I am driven with a mission from God’. God would tell me, ‘George go and fight these terrorists in Afghanistan’. And I did. And then God would tell me ‘George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq’. And I did.

      “”And now, again, I feel God’s words coming to me, ‘Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East’. And, by God, I’m gonna do it.

      –George W. Bush

      • orchidcup says:

        And I just — I cannot speak strongly enough about how we must collectively get after those who kill in the name of — in the name of some kind of false religion.

        –George W. Bush [Press appearance with King Abdullah of Jordan, Aug. 1, 2002]

        I’m sure there is some kind of heavy doctrinal difference, which I’m not sophisticated enough to explain to you.

        –George W. Bush Explaining the issues involved in his switching from attending an Episcopal church to attending a Methodist one, (date is approximate:), Jul. 1, 1994

        I’m also mindful that man should never try to put words in God’s mouth. I mean, we should never ascribe natural disasters or anything else to God. We are in no way, shape, or form should a human being, play God.

        –George W. Bush Washington, D.C., Jan. 14, 2005

        I trust God speaks through me. Without that, I couldn’t do my job.

        –George W. Bush Statement made during campaign visit to Amish community, Lancaster County, Pennsylvania, Jul. 9, 2004

  20. The Monster's Lawyer says:

    Reality needs no religion. It is what it is.
    Science needs no believers. Science is self heeling.
    Religion is the opiate of the masses.

    • bobbo, are we Men of Science, or Devo says:

      Science needs no believers. /// Correct. Its the reverse that is true: Believers need science. Something that is pragmatic, works, is real. It just doesn’t answer questions that have no answers.

      Its a heartache.

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