1. BobH says:

    I certainly do enjoying lobbing red meat to lions; but damn, I wish we could chuck in a few Christians just for splatter sport.

    Lauren the Ghoti —

    “pair-bonded, affectionate couple engaging in conventional sexual activity”

    70% of whom will end up in divorce and fellating the next fellow who comes. BTW, love that PC “pair bonded” BS. Code for “NOT QUEER”.

    Greg Allen —

    “inappropriate sexual behavior”

    If it was inappropriate, you wouldn’t ask your wife to do it. And if you don’t ask you wife to do it, you should. Sword swallowing has been acceptable since the first cave coupled figured out it was fun. Note: I don’t differentiate between heterosexual or homosexual spelunkers.

    Rape and child molestation are and should be against the law. More importantly, those specific statutes should be enforced. The rest of the “moral” code is religious prejudice and has no place in the world today.

    “sanity and common sense”

    Give me a break. You’re spouting Christian claptrap. Just because you believe it does not make it real.

  2. TIHZ_HO says:

    #19 Sound reasonable.

    The strange thing is who would EVER think of picking up a piece of toilet paper from the floor of a public toilet? Even if I was the one who dropped it there it stays!

    Once again this proves to leave the thinking to the larger head.

    Well one less idiot in power – how many more left to go huh?

    Cheers

  3. BobH says:

    joshua

    “That girl died because of his behavior and lack of balls, nothing more.”

    You do NOT know the facts; however you are welcome to your belief pending release of the accurate information. Suffice to say I agree with you on one point: a girl died.

    “blow job trauma is acceptable to a child….I think you need long and intensive therapy yourself.”

    Thank You for your diagnosis. Alas, I’m dismayed to discover you find a blow job traumatic. Something you’d like to share?

  4. KevinL says:

    Of course he’s not gay. He a sick f*cker just like gays.

    What is it anyway about another man’s hairy ass?

  5. Mr. Fusion says:

    #25, Bob,

    I agree. Well made argument.

    #28, Lauren,

    “What’s the issue with a kid seeing a blow job in the stall?”

    For a person to even ask such a question is a telling sign of how “tolerance” and value relativism has completely eaten away sanity and common sense in the West.

    How about because exposure to dysfunctional sexual behavior in childhood can permanently imprint dysfunctional associations?

    If you don’t think 98% of kids that understand what a BJ have not also seen one performed via the internet, you are truly missing something. If merely witnessing a BJ will permanently imprint a person’s sexuality, then there is a whole mess of screwed up people out there.

    Do I really want my eight yr old daughter to watch a couple of old gays blowing each other? Of course not. She will discover it happens from the school yard. She will be exposed to sex accidentally via email. The only way to prevent it is to put her in a convent.

  6. Mr. Fusion says:

    Yes, Craig is probably a hypocrite and I have little use for people of his stripe. I do, however, like to keep it all in perspective. This should be about entrapment, not Craig’s hypocrisy.

    Where is it written that touching the foot of the person in the stall next to you is an overt sign you want a sexual encounter? He didn’t ask for sex. He didn’t offer sex. He didn’t offer money for something unsaid? So what is the crime?

    Will an unspoken look at a hooker become grounds to be charged with solicitation? Will a glance at a woman become attempted rape. Will being in the same restaurant as Karl Rove subject you to violating the National Secrets Act?

    Craig’s mistake was in pleading guilty. He, however, had no choice. Republicans believe once you are charged with a crime, you are automatically guilty. Unless the Democrats may somehow be blamed. Ya, that’s it. The cop is a Democrat.

  7. Mr. Fusion says:

    #31, joshua,

    As to your theory that blow job trauma is acceptable to a child….I think you need long and intensive therapy yourself.

    Are you speaking from personal experience? Didn’t you once claim to have a healthy sexual attitude?

    Neither party has a lock on pervs in the ranks, we are going through a Republican storm at the moment, but it will change again, it always does.

    The difference is the Republicans go to such lengths to decry such behavior while Democrats accept people different than them.

    A short while ago you claimed in one of your posts that Democrats were worse than Republicans when it came to corruption. I’m glad you are changing your tune.

  8. Hal says:

    Maybe Mr. Craig didn’t see this video.

  9. doug says:

    wow, it makes me some sort of Christian prude because I would like to be able to use a public mens room without encountering people having sex?

    geez, and here I thought I was teetering between atheism and agnosticism.

    And for the record, given the choice of witnessing that or a murder, I would prefer to witness Closeted Republican Fun-Time. Fortunately, that is a false choice – murder should not be happening at all, and neither should be happening in public.

    Get a room.

    #39. As it was said in ‘The Onion’ – I don’t know what the Republicans are so damn mad about, its not like Sen Craig was trying to MARRY the guy.

  10. BobH says:

    doug

    “I would like to be able to use a public mens room without encountering people having sex?”

    Don’t peek – I’m sure the door was closed. Not once, in over 6 decades, have I entered a public restroom and encountered someone engaged in anything more bizarre than birthing a bigot in bowl sans courtesy flush. If you, by contrast, find yourself constantly exposed to hot sex in the loo, you may want to reconsider your choice of comfort station.

    BTW, I’d like to have a President with intelligence, a Senator with integrity, and a nation of people who believed in science rather than Christianity. Oh, yes, and Santa… can you make it so people who make potty in public at least wash their hands after?

  11. Mr. Fusion says:

    #41, doug,

    And for the record, given the choice of witnessing that or a murder, … (snip) … neither should be happening in public.

    Very true and I agree. Yet so many people are pretending that there was some “hanky panky” going on in that washroom. There wasn’t. There was a touching of feet and a hand under the stall wall that the cop somehow found to be a sexual solicitation. There was no reported sex.

    If there are two guys going at it in a public washroom, then by all means bust them. Please, however, don’t confuse what Craig is accused of with there being actual sex. In no way can any of that be considered lewd behavior.

  12. Mister Mustard says:

    >>Yet so many people are pretending that there was
    >>some “hanky panky” going on in that washroom. There wasn’t.

    No, there was solicitation of hanky-panky. When the cops bust some guy for soliciting prostitution, they don’t wait until he actually hides the salami. In a known gay cruising spot, I think playing footsies, prolonged peekie-boo into the guy’s stall, and making the secret hand motions underneath the stall partitions qualifies.

    Even though the guy only pled guilty to disorderly misconduct, there isn’t a person over the age of 10 who doesn’t know what he was REALLY up to. “Wide stance” my ass.

  13. doug says:

    #42. You don’t have to peek to know that two people are having sex in a stall. Plus, what if you have to USE the stall, eh? It is the height of discourtesy to others in addition to being something that people going about their ordinary business should not have to encounter.

    Get a room.

    #43. Oh, yeah – Craig wasn’t actually having sex, but Bob suggests that would have been no problem at all. That’s what I was addressing.

    Frankly, I am used to hypocritical politicians – to paraphrase Captain Willard, “Calling politicians hypocrites is like handing out speeding tickets at the Indy 500” – but this takes it to the next level.

    The funniest part of this whole episode is how shocked, SHOCKED the cop was that a United States Senator would be LYING to him. “People vote for you!”

    I didn’t know they let 6-year-olds onto the force in Minneapolis.

  14. doug says:

    oh, and speaking of hypocritical politicians. those small-government Republicans from out Idaho way liked Craig because he was a tall hog at the Federal trough:

    “many … prominent state Republicans said they were in disbelief at the turn of events. They expressed sympathy and gratitude for a powerful senator who had supported their campaigns and brought millions of dollars in federal money to Idaho.”

    http://tinyurl.com/ywosz7

  15. BobH says:

    Doug

    “Plus, what if you have to USE the stall, eh?”

    “Try the next door or wait till they finish. That said, if you must enter, keep in mind three’s a crowd. You might consider adding colorful, blow-by-blow commentary.

  16. doug says:

    #47. Yeah, right – there tend to be lots of spare stalls in airports when the planes start arriving.

    Get a room.

  17. Misanthropic Scott says:

    #5 – hhopper,

    Why is that a problem? No one is alleging rape. No one was under age. If it was his wife in a stall would it matter? It’s just sex people. Get over it. I always like it when hypocritical republicans resign.

    However, this case should not be a case at all. If a crime was committed, then it is the law that is in error. Some people like sex in bathroom stalls. I do not understand that. However, it’s none of my damn business.

    Of course, being a bigot and a hypocrite, a lying hypocrite at that, is a good reason to get someone out of office. However, none of this should ever have seen the light of day.

    If there’s no victim, there’s no crime. Someone show me a victim.

    OK, the guy is actually a hypocrite and a liar. I’ll stop defending the bastard now.

    #9 – Anonymous Coward,

    The quote from the T-Shirts is “I’m not gay, but my penis is.” So, perhaps only his penis is gay.

    #21 – Greg Allen,

    1) Doesn’t take more than a second, let alone a minute or two.
    2) No.
    3) No.

    And, I’m not even homophobic.

    #25 – BobH,

    Very well said, thanks.

    #28 – Lauren,

    But to think that witnessing mentally unhealthy strangers compulsively engaging in deviant sexual behavior in a public place doesn’t place a prepubescent child at high risk of major psychological trauma is beyond idiotic, it’s borderline criminal.

    What part was compulsive, deviant, or mentally unhealthy?

    All commenters on teh #25 thread:

    And, where did anyone say that a child witnessed any of this? If the stall door is closed, it’s private. If not, we need better public rest rooms. OK, actually, we do need better public rest rooms.

    Does anyone here think it makes a difference whether this is gay or straight? Stranger or wife? I certainly hope not. As long as it was consensual with no one under age and the stall doors closed, it’s just one of many odd fetishes to like sex in a rest room stall. No one gets hurt. There is no victim. There is no crime.

    Too bad we don’t have any politicians, especially on the right, that would stand up and say, “Yup. I just like same sex sex in the rest room. That should be everyone’s right.” Of course, this whack job is publicly against such behavior when he’s not engaging in it, so I’ve got little sympathy.

  18. hhopper says:

    Scott – Promiscuous gay men in restrooms is a major problem. Many of the restrooms in my area have been closed because of this.

  19. Misanthropic Scott says:

    #50 – hhopper,

    Would you be more specific about the problem? Are they making a mess? Are they not using stalls? Not closing doors? Not being quiet?

    What do you propose the solution is? Outlaw homosexuality? Outlaw promiscuity?

    Who are the victims of this problem?

  20. doug says:

    #51. Outlaw sex – gay or straight – in public places?

    yes.

    Get a room.

  21. Mister Mustard says:

    >>Does anyone here think it makes a difference whether this is
    >>gay or straight?

    Only to the extent that the “honorable” Senator has spent his life trying to criminalize, marginalize, and culturally exterminate gays in the name of his hallowed “Family Values”. All the while, he’s cruising gay pickup spots looking to suck some anonymous dick.

    I don’t think that sort of shit should be a crime at all (unless it involves children); I would have been satisfied with a YouTube video “outing” the hypocritical lying sack of shit as he took a load of hot cum on his face. No charges necessary; just replay the video for his holy-roller constituents and let them decide. If it had been Barney Frank who was caught, I’d say who cares? But a homophobic “Family Values” champion from the right wing? Now THAT is news!

  22. Misanthropic Scott says:

    #52 – doug,

    Interesting question. Is a rest room stall a public place? If so, why does no one get arrested for indecent exposure for taking a dump in one?

    As I stated above, maybe we just need better rest room stalls. I’ve long thought that the amount of privacy provided in one of the typical U.S. stalls is insufficient.

    #53 – MM,

    Agreed. Except, the person in question is a cop. Did the cop know that this was a senator when this took place? Is that the only reason that this came to light? Or, were there charges involved? I was under the impression that charges were involved. That’s just wrong.

    I’d much rather have heard a civilian gay one night stand out him. A palimony suit would have been even better. If it had to be a cop, why the charges? Why not just the publicity, as you suggest?

    Other than that though, overall, I am still very glad to be rid of one more of these wing-nut anti-everything-not-in-the-bible whack jobs.

  23. hhopper says:

    The restrooms I referred to were in local city and county parks. There were many gay guys meeting there. After a number of busts, they decided to close them. That sort of sucked for the public (no pun intended.)

  24. Misanthropic Scott says:

    #55 – hhopper,

    So, you’re saying that the problem is that this is currently against the law, causing unnecessary arrests and rest room closures, right? Or, do you see any real crimes with real victims in this?

  25. hhopper says:

    Damn Scott, you’re trying to get me into a major debate here! OK, I think the problem is a bunch of perverts hanging around in restrooms and the stupid city and county commissioners close them instead of facing the problem.

  26. Misanthropic Scott says:

    #57 – hhopper,

    Yes, I’m trying to get you into a debate because I enjoy debates. If you want I’ll stop. Or, you can just stop responding.

    You said promiscuous gay men in restrooms were the problem. Now you call them perverts. I would like to know if you’d feel the same way if it was straight sex in the rest rooms. What if it was just a popular place for straight young adults? How about if it was popular among a significant number of straight married couples? In short, what part of this is perverted to you? To me, it seems pretty minor.

    If the concern is that someone underage will see them, full length walls and doors would help tremendously. Most other countries I’ve been to have them. Europe and pretty much all of Latin America do. In France, it is common to have the urinals and sinks in a common area and full height single toilet stalls for use by both sexes off of that. Such stalls could certainly permit private sex in them. Perhaps that would solve your issue without criminalizing sex.

    Either way, the inside of a stall is considered private enough to undress and is therefore, clearly not a public place. Why is it not private enough for sex?

  27. KevinL says:

    #57 hhopper – And the reason these city and county commissioners are powerless to do anything about this is echoed on this thread. “How dare you tell me I can’t suck another man’s dick in a public restroom! If you don’t want to see this then you and your kid can look the other way. You must be a bigot and you are taking away my rights! Hello, is this the ACLU?” A much better solution is to simply close the facilities then to face that.

  28. Greg Allen says:

    BobH,

    The inappropriate sexual behavior, IMHO, is sex in a public place.

    I’m a liberal so I value tolerance very highly — the sex lives of gays are of no concern to me but young boys should have to witness Republican senators getting blow jobs.

    That’s the kind of childhood trauma which breeds more “family values” self loathing gay Republicans and goodness knows the world doesn’t need any more of those!

  29. Mr. Fusion says:

    #44, MM,

    No, there was solicitation of hanky-panky. When the cops bust some guy for soliciting prostitution, they don’t wait until he actually hides the salami. In a known gay cruising spot, I think playing footsies, prolonged peekie-boo into the guy’s stall, and making the secret hand motions underneath the stall partitions qualifies.

    Bullshit. I’m a traveler. I don’t know that is a “gay hot spot”. I also have no idea what “gay solicitation signs” are. NO effen idea other then a “Hey, ya wanna blow me”.

    If you want to suggest that some of these possible innocent actions are “gay solicitation” then fine. But until Craig or some other person actually asks for a sexual favor or makes some comment about money then there has been no solicitation. This is a bullshit charge where the vast majority would plead guilty just to make it go away because the public knowledge would ruin him. As happened with Craig.

    Do you want some cop deciding some innocent action you just made is a covert invitation to commit a sex crime? How are you going to fight it? You let this stand then next time it will be some kid being arrested because a high five is the new gang banger sign.

  30. Mr. Fusion says:

    Scott,

    Damn you !!! You bring up this idea about whether a washroom stall is a private place or a public place. Now I know what will keep me awake tonight.

    *

    Once last comment on this thread.

    I want to see Republicans of all stripes removed. But in the voting booth. This is an unfair ambush. If there is some evidence against Craig, then let’s see it. If there isn’t, then let the guy alone.


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