School children who have never had a flu shot may need to get vaccinated four times in the fall – twice for seasonal flu, twice for pandemic swine flu – officials at the CDC told health professionals on Wednesday.
Most everyone else should expect three shots.
[…]
“This vaccine campaign will unfold quite differently than seasonal flu,” said Wortley, in a conference call with health care professionals nationwide on Wednesday. “This is a huge endeavor we’re gearing up for.”
[…]
Preservative-free shots will be available for children and pregnant women, about 20 percent of the lots manufactured, Wortley said. They will either come in single-dose injections or as Flu Mist, the live virus that is squirted into the nose.Adults will most likely get their shots from multi-dose vials which contain Thimerisol, including very low levels of mercury.
[…]
There are a number of newer vaccine technologies that are now under development, including cell-based vaccines and vaccines grown in fall armyworm cells. Those won’t be among the tier 1 vaccines used in the United States, Wortley said.
[…]
Wortley said the CDC is setting up a process for tracking adverse reactions to the shots, including the rare but potentially fatal Guillain-Barré syndrome, an autoimmune disorder that can be temporarily paralyzing.
Another informational site for fighting the anti-vax believers.
(Thanks to Todd W. et al for creating the site)
J/P=?
#28, okay, parallel scenario: If we experience a major climate shift where there was a long-term problem of the supply of food not being able to adequately feed the population, would you be in favor of forced sterilization to restrict population growth?
#29. Sticks and stones bro’ sticks and stones.
“Gee, I think it went into summer time retreat presumably to mutate and return this fall==just like the Great Flu of 1916.”
Yeah, I’ll hold my breath. But seriously, when was it that you became Fusions bitch?
#31–SL==of course. What else would be compassionate and rational?
#32–someone==of course, you are right. Over the mark to suggest you will be stupid forever. That would assume you have no interest in learning anything.
My bad.
I think I’ll get my regular flue shot then consider the rest.
#33, and you see, that is the source of our disagreement – I don’t take being rational to be that people can be treated like cattle, even if I’ve rationalized that it’s in their best interests.
Ten dumbass reasons why people don’t get their flu shots
http://pusware.com/rdct/?p=92
case closed!
Enforced quarantine – possibly reasonable under some circumstances.
Enforced injection of vaccine including from Baxter who sent bird flu contaminated seasonal flu vaccines all over Europe and wide-scale forced testing (this will be testing) which is in breach of the the Nuremberg Code – dangerous / insane / immoral.
#35–SL==and so WITHIN the hypothetical you proposed, what would you do? Presumably allow/permit/encourage/counsel against people having more kids? I guess then everyone else alive is supposed to get proportionately less food ((ie, within your hypothetical, the weakest in numbers equal to the newborn must starve to death)), or is it that the parents of the new kiddies do not get any additional food at all and then the choice of themselves or their own kiddies starving becomes their choice?
What is the humane thing to do on lifeboat earth if there is only enough food to feed those currently living?
#38, gee thanks bobbo, you’ve saved me from having to babble, since somewhere in there you’ve expressed my answer for me.
Considering how mild this “pandemic” seems to be why is there such a rush to inject children with rushed though vaccination shots? I never get flu shots and I never get the flu. Why would I want to get a shot that probably was rushed through the process in order to fight a flu strain that seems to be weak compared to regular old seasonal flu? People keep throwing around how millions will die and those not getting “a shot of protection” may as well just start digging the hole now. I can’t imagine living in a state of panic like that.
Seems like this swine flu panic is as overblown as it was in the 70’s.
#39–SL==so what is your answer?
# 38 bobbo, as Sea Lawyer starts to babble
There is enough food to feed those currently living. 36 million die each year from starvation (they should get a job).
For example, Australia which is mostly dry and highly drought prone is capable of feeding double it’s population and does through export (even with highly inefficient and wasteful water management), most of Europe’s cut flowers come from Africa (instead of Africa growing food), British farmers are paid not to farm their land, Zimbabwe – Mugabe – bullet to the head, etc. etc.
#42–LDA==what you say is completely 100% correct – – – – but irrelevant. I am responding to a limited fact set hypothetical proposed by Sea Lawyer. Evidently, he doesn’t even understand his own hypothetical because he left himself with only self centered asshole LIBERTARIAN choices, then criticizes “moi” as being anti-humanitarian.
As is the case for most people who don’t even understand what a hypothetical is, the truth is just the opposite.
Will SL man up and admit his error, or claim tangent? Curious people want to know.
Just in case anyone wants to actually read about the real mercury issue from a publication dedicated to debunking myths, check this out from the Skeptics Society.
http://tinyurl.com/kkba2a
# bobbo, stating the obvious
I was not countering the hypothetical I was contributing to the wider discussion. 36 million people die from starvation while being ‘helped’ by the same people (WHO etc.) that want to force vaccinate the population of the world for a virus that has killed few with a vaccine produced partly by Baxter who a couple of months ago sent vaccines contaminated with live bird flu (which is a great way to get a mutated strain started) all over Europe and people suggest only stupid conspiracy theorists with there wacko theories object to forced vaccination because they are ignorant of science.
I quoted your post for clarity only. The points I made are relevant for the growing zombie population that assert there are too many people.
Parallel scenario, if climate change is a scam and there was enough food for everyone would you agree to forced euthanasia of advocates of forced euthanasia and catastrophic climate change.
If the moon was made of cheese and you were the Führer of the New World Order would you…
#45–Luke==the force of clear logic is turning you to the dark side. Pull UP!!! Before it is too late.
Hypotheticals are of great value to set parameters to define terms to differentiate about what the decision points in a dialectic really are. Too many people are too fuzzy in their own thinking, they don’t even actually understand why they think what they think, or rather, what they think they think because they aren’t thinking at all, just parrotry.
So I like hypotheticals and try not to avoid them by claiming they don’t take in enough facts, or are otherwise not up to some other point they aren’t even trying to address.
Capiche?
To your point–there was no wider discussion about food. The only discussion was within the hypothetical frames for unknown reasons as yet, by Sea Lawyer. Evidently, you don’t know the function of a hypothetical either. It is not a launching stage for whatever tangents you wish to introduce. Such diversions destroy the beauty and utility of the learning moment==one learns nothing from hop scotching from issue to issue.
Now, I don’t know, and assume you don’t know either, that the same people at Who do not advocate/manage the vaccination program as the food program. So, very simply you are wrong. THAT doesn’t “add” anything to a discussion, relevant or otherwise.
Are there too many people? ((One of Scott’s favorite harangues.)) Thats all definitional and totally dependent on how you define the terms==hypotheticals of a sort again. Course, I think there is some sort of “dodge” going on with people starving to death but the causation is only food distribution issues and not overpopulation. There will ALWAYS be food distribution problems so that is a variable that in good faith drops out of consideration.
I so agree with you fanciful hypothetical. Those knowingly scamming people and causing death would certainly be eligible for the death penalty or other suitable punishment for such knowing crimes===all within your hypothetical.
Man! Thimerisol, Thiomersal, Thimerosal, Merthiolate, how many names does this stuff have?
I think the conspiracy theorists have it backwards — it’s the “we need to kill off a lot of people” crowd encouraging the anti-vaccine groups…
# 46 bobbo, has anyone seen my nose (and others)
Capisco, your English (and Americanized Italian) is perfectly comprehensible.
I do understand the concept of a hypothetical scenario (and even have a dictionary) and if you can respond to the hypothetical I posed then I assume you understand that and your rhetorical flourishes are for your own enjoyment.
I am contributing to the wider discussion as are you, “Did You Know Enforced Swine Flu Shot This Fall Is Really Multiple Shots?” with special attention to the compulsory element and have .
It would however seem that you have mostly averted to your two way hypothetical culdesac, which has it’s own value I understand (for one thing it gave me the opportunity to contribute the argument about food for which I am grateful).
“There will ALWAYS be food distribution problems”, I suspect vaccine distribution problems to be much less of a problem.
Re: WHO, you do not know, therefor I am wrong? Interesting logic.
The Director-General is responsible for the whole WHO body (that is why it is called an organization and why they are called the Director-General). It does not matter what individuals or sections wish to advocate the organization as a whole mandates how both programs will be ‘managed’.
“…you don’t know the function of a hypothetical either. It is not a launching stage for whatever tangents you wish to introduce.”
If this blog were not a launching stage for hypothetical two way conversations or tangential arguments it would have much less traffic. The hypothetical situation was a tangent from the post and my comment was a tangent from the hypothetical. So what? The points I made were not purely for your consumption or to counter your arguments.
Wakarimashita?
#43, well bobbo, since you are clearly opposed to any position I might take that doesn’t jive with your anti “LIEBERTARIAN” one, then there really is no reason to continue, but just to humor you, I will.
You should very easily be able to see a similarity between supporting forced sterilization during a severe, long-term food shortage, and supporting forced vaccination during a global pandemic. Both come with the idea that you have some authority to assume absolute control over the very body of another person because you’ve deemed that the right of a person to control their own body isn’t important when the rights of society (whatever that means) is concerned. And as I also said, this is completely different than prohibiting people from taking a shit in the drinking water.
So as I suggested, you appear to have the belief that, should you deem it necessary, people are nothing more than cattle to be lined up to have whatever done to them that you think is for their own good.
i fail to see why there is all this hoopla over the swine flu..it hasn’t even hit regular flu levels in thew U.S. yet..
*shrug* i’ll stick with my silver solution, tyvm.
-s
#48–Luke==”jotu mati” your aim would have been more clear had you NOT referenced your comments to MY POST. From that perspective, being worse than tangential, being completely irrelevant to the hypothetical that WAS under discussion is not adding anything to the discussion. As stated, it operated to minimize and kill it. Point – Counterpoint. Not Point === something else totally irrelevant. A conversation. Not ad libs. Choose the high road Luke. Bakka Bakka otherwise.
#49–SL==well, the biggest reason to respond is so I can show you where you are WRONG. While we can both save time by you assuming your disagreements with me are all wrong, you actually have the chance of learning something by responding. No one has learned everything there is to know, hopefully we honor learning and look forward to it without spite?
You still haven’t answered the question. WHAT WOULD YOU DO? The alternatives I offered are not identical, they have different ramifications on the morality scale. Of course I see similarities. AND I see dissimilarities. I weigh and contrast them. I rank order and process them thru different value systems. Self Actualization, public responsibility, LIEBERTARIANISM, profligate reproductive irresponsibility, foreseeable harm, relative harm etc.
In YOUR hypothetical, my main value is in respecting a conscious formed living consciousness–a born human being–over the potentialities of the unborn. How humane/responsible is it to bring a child into this world that you can’t feed? How humane is it to bring a child into this world and feed it by taking food away from another human being? “IF” I am treating people like cattle, how would you characterize your limited choices? Hmmmm?
but its funny you critize me for not seeing similarities when that is the very flaw you exhibit. You agree that there should be no freedom to shit in the public water supply but FAIL to see that shitting enfluenza virii into the air supply is not EXACTLY the same thing. What a dismal lack of insight.
So—what would you do SL?
#51 bobbo ======== the force, has got a lot of power, and, it makes me feel like, it, it makes me feel like… OOOOH!
Tangent; latin – touching (on). Global warming > not enough food – (tangent) – not enough food > people say that already > there is enough food. Simple really.
“#49–SL==well, the biggest reason to…”.
I guess I didn’t kill your facsinating intillectual stoush (I guess you do not understand what kill means). The only way I could minimize it is WITH A LOT OF UNNECESSARY CAPITALIZATION == and ===== punctuation.
Toboo nuki.
#26, Someone,
Bird Flu is still around. The largest reason it has not become more prevelant is the way it effects the body. Its infection rate is very low for an influenza.
The infection takes root deep in the lungs. That means the virus must be breathed deeply in. So far all those who have come down with the disease were poultry workers. It was their constant proximity that allowed them to catch the disease. Yet those same effected workers do not infect others.
Scientists are worried that it might mutate to something that does not need to be so deeply inhaled. Then it would become much more communicable.
Good point.
#53–Luke==your star fighter is vacillating and cartwheeling out of control. We hear your communication, but it is garbled beyond recognition. Switch to back up frequencies.
If the question is would reduced populations reduce the incidence of starvation, the fact that enough food is grown to feed everyone is not dispositive. You see, there is more than one variable. I know, always more difficult to think about multi-variable events. So whatever tangential addition you think you are making serves only to misdirect.
Turn away from the dark side.
#49, SL,
Bobbo is quite correct in his analogy. And I don’t agree with him solely for his good looks.
Where I live, everyone has a septic system and everyone uses well water. If your septic fails or you decide you shouldn’t have to use it, your raw sewage can enter the aquifer that the rest of us drink from. And yes, there have been some knuckle dragging, back to nature, gun nut, Liebertarian, red neck types that insist they don’t have to meet the County’s Septic Standards. And that is shitting in MY drinking water.
*
The right of the individual can never outweigh the right of the society to exist. The best example is that of Typhoid Mary; a cook that was a carrier of typhoid even though she never displayed any symptoms a century ago. Even though she was aware she carried the disease and was infecting others, she refused to stop working in food preparation. Several people are known to have died as a result and she ended up being held in an asylum, twice. The second time until she died.
So, either you agree that Typhoid Mary had a right to ignore the safety of everyone else around her OR society had the right to hold her against her will for the good of all.
Influenza is most contagious during the first few days of infection, even though the person might not have any symptoms yet. After the body’s immune system starts taking control, the contagious aspect is reduced significantly.
Folks you have got to do diligent research on forced vaccinations upcomming.Visit websites of Dr. Shari Tenpenny or Dr. Mercola or go to website http://www.naturalnews.com and look for Swine flu vaccinations info. Do research on the 1916 Swine Flu pandemic that killed millions worldwide and the horror that occurred in hospitals. Another good source of information is website of Geroge Noory on Coast to Coast AM radio 840 on your dial 10:00 pm (pst) nightly on radio with guest experts WARNING the public of what is comming and WHY.
I have heard from several different people at various times about how the government is utilizing the flu shot to make people sick. I do not trust the flu shot or any other vaccine, for that matter. I am beyond against it! I will not have some quack putting some foreign product into my body or that of my children. I do not trust people, anybody, not the doctors, not the government. I think the doctors are pro shot people so they make money.. and well.. the government is pro killing people.. I’m not too far off the mark, either.. I am in agreement with quite a few people who have this gut feeling. I do not trust there for I am to be left alone!.. and so are my kids.