The news that New York Cardinal Timothy Dolan, the nation’s most prominent Catholic prelate, will deliver the closing blessing to the Republican National Convention in Florida next week was seen as a huge coup for Mitt Romney, the party’s presumptive nominee. But the move has also prompted a sharp debate within the church over the increasingly close ties between leading bishops and the GOP.

The cozy relationship between a sizable portion of U.S. bishops and the Republican Party should be cause for concern, and not just among progressive Catholics,” Michael O’Loughlin wrote in a post on the website of America magazine, a leading Catholic weekly published by the Jesuits.

“Cardinal Dolan’s appearance in Tampa will damage the church’s ability to be a moral and legitimate voice for voiceless, as those who view the Catholic Church as being a shill for the GOP have just a bit more evidence to prove their case,” O’Loughlin concluded…

Similarly, David Cruz-Uribe, a member of the Secular Franciscan Order and a professor of mathematics at Trinity College, wrote on the Vox Nova blog that Dolan’s decision “will only drag the Church further into a partisan divide and fuel the perception (true or not) that the Catholic Church wants to replace the Episcopalians as the Republican party on its knees…”

They share a war on Women – denying reproductive rights, abortion, birth control, IVF – even the papal edict against a woman choosing to abort to save her own life. They oppose civil rights for the LGBT community. They demand that religious dogma and doctrine take precedence over civil law. All that may be missing from the podium that night is an appearance by one of those uppity nuns – gagged and in chains.

  1. orchidcup says:

    Nothing can be more exactly and seriously true than what is there [the very words only of Jesus] stated; that but a short time elapsed after the death of the great reformer of the Jewish religion, before his principles were departed from by those who professed to be his special servants, and perverted into an engine for enslaving mankind, and aggrandising their oppressors in Church and State; that the purest system of morals ever before preached to man, has been adulterated and sophisticated by artificial constructions, into a mere contrivance to filch wealth and power to themselves; that rational men not being able to swallow their impious heresies, in order to force them down their throats, they raise the hue and cry of infidelity, while themselves are the greatest obstacles to the advancement of the real doctrines of Jesus, and do in fact constitute the real Anti-Christ.

    — Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826), US Founding Father, drafted the Declaration of Independence, 3rd US President
    Source: letter to Samuel Kerchreview, January 19, 1810

    • What? says:


      Both beautiful and hypocritical (enslaving, etc).

      TJ writes a good sentence.

  2. orchidcup says:

    The priesthood have, in all ancient nations, nearly monopolized learning…. And, even since the Reformation, when or where has existed a Protestant or dissenting sect who would tolerate A FREE INQUIRY?

    The blackest billingsgate, the most ungentlemanly insolence, the most yahooish brutality is patiently endured, countenanced, propagated, and applauded.

    But touch a solemn truth in collision with a dogma of a sect, though capable of the clearest proof, and you will soon find you have disturbed a nest, and the hornets will swarm about your legs and hands, and fly into your face and eyes.

    The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity. Nowhere in the Gospels do we find a precept for Creeds, Confessions, Oaths, Doctrines, and whole car-loads of other foolish trumpery that we find in Christianity.

    — John Adams (1735-1826) Founding Father, 2nd US President

  3. steve says:

    The Democratic National Committee is raising a number of eyebrows after choosing to proceed with hosting Islamic “Jumah” prayers for two hours on the Friday of its convention, though it denied a Catholic cardinal’s request to say a prayer at the same event.

    • orchidcup says:

      Duke University holds Jummah prayer services for Muslim students every Friday:

      Jummah (Arabic: جمعة‎) (also known as Friday prayer) is a congregational prayer (salaat) that Muslims hold every Friday around noontime. It is mentioned in the Qur’an as:

      “O you who believe! when the call is made for prayer on Friday, then hasten to the remembrance of Allah and leave off trading; that is better for you, if you know. And when the prayer is ended, then disperse in the land and seek of Allah’s bounty, and remember Allah much, that ye may be successful.” (Qur’an 62: 9-10)

      Jummah is held every Friday on campus at two locations. Prayers are led by the Chaplain, students, guest Imams and Duke faculty. All are welcome to attend and observe.

      If a Muslim requested to pray at a Catholic service, would the Catholics allow it?

      • NobodySpecial says:

        Duke university is a known hotbed of immorality.
        Many of it’s students matriculate quite openly in public, it has known homo-sapiens among its faculty and many of it’s drama course teachers are thespians.

  4. orchidcup says:

    During almost fifteen centuries the legal establishment of Christianity has been upon trial.

    What has been its fruits?

    More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry, and persecution.

    –James Madison (1751-1836), Father of the Constitution for the USA, 4th US President

  5. NobodySpecial says:

    Well done, first going on holiday with Jews and now allowing catholics in. At this rate pretty soon the republicans will have a black president!

    • orchidcup says:

      If a President can be a Mormon, then why not a Muslim?

      Better yet, a black Muslim female President!

  6. orchidcup says:

    As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of Morals and his Religion, as he left them to us, the best the World ever saw or is likely to see; but I apprehend it has received various corrupting Changes; and I have, with most of the present Dissenters in England, some doubts as to his divinity.

    — Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790) US Founding Father

    • NobodySpecial says:

      Well obviously all the stuff he wrote about obedience to the authorities, killing commies/muslims and paying tax is very worthy.

      But all that hippy shit about not judging others, turning the other cheek and loving your neighbor was just propaganda.

  7. NewformatSux says:

    Obama picked a war with the Catholic Church, telling them they must violate their religious beliefs.

    • orchidcup says:

      Contraception and birth control are not mentioned in the Bible, if that is what you refer to.

      • NewformatSux says:

        So now you wish to dictate the tenets of a religion to its members?

        • orchidcup says:

          In such cases where the tenets of a religion conflict with the law.

          If the tenets of a religion require the stoning to death of an adulterous woman, which side are you on?

          If the tenets of a religion require withholding medical care from a sick child because the parents believe prayer will heal the child, which side are you on?

          • Dallas says:

            Good one, but cafeteria Christians are tricky in keeping with a topic.

            Kind of like politicians.

          • NobodySpecial says:

            Damn government interference.
            As a devout satanist I believe the prince of darkness will protect my employees – but that OSHA still insists I fit safety railings.

            Everybody knows gravity is just “a theory”

          • NewformatSux says:

            No, you were clearly arguing that the mandates being presented are not violations of Catholic doctrine. Now you twist it to say that the law should be allowed to interfere with Catholic doctrine.

          • Mextli: ABO says:

            Or Peyote ceremonies, which side are you on?

    • Sea Lawyer says:

      Specifically the idea that the federal government is going to mandate that employers must provide x service in their health insurance plans that the employer does not wish to provide. We have strayed so far beyond any semblance of the 18th century notion of “regulation” that the government has now claimed for itself the absolute power to dictate the terms of trade.

      • Dallas says:

        Some things, like clean water, police, fire, schools, sewage, streets, dog shit, wild animals, rocket propelled grenades, shitting on sidewalks, animal abuse, fucking minors and basic healthcare, should be a public policy issue enforced by government .

        • Sea Lawyer says:

          The purpose of bith control pills is to interfere with the normal functions of the body and should not, by definition be called “healthcare,” even if I did agree with your premise. Other than that, nothing is preventing women from buying they own fucking pills, pun intended.

  8. AdmFubar says:

    ♫Hallelujah!!♫ – Mitt-witt Romney

    ♫ Democrats to the left me, Republicans to my right. here i am stuck in the middle with you! ♫

    it is me or are our politics and politicians sounding more and more taliban like??

  9. NewformatSux says:

    when the stadium lights go out, and those Styrofoam Greek columns are hauled back to some studio lot — what exactly is our opponent’s plan? What does he actually seek to accomplish, after he’s done turning back the waters and healing our planet? The answer is to make government bigger… take more of your money… give you more orders from Washington… and to reduce the strength of America in a dangerous world.

    Sarah Palin recognized Obama perfectly.

  10. AdmFubar says:

    obama didnt pick that “war” as you call it…
    you gotta follow the money.. big pharma is pulling the strings on that, why should religious beliefs get in the way of making profit? as far as big corporations are concerned, you shouldnt have such freedoms.. which is why you are seeing corporate america legislate the purchase of products, not based on any actual necessity by the consumer.

  11. msbpodcast says:

    Who gives a fuck?

    Some fat prick selling total BS is shaking his wattles and flapping his jaw. So what?

    The end result is … nothing changes.

  12. Dallas says:

    Some day the sheeple will realize the Christian Taliban infiltration of our government is the greatest threat to rights and freedoms.

    Sadly, they fear communism and Russian attack from the east.

    • orchidcup says:

      The 1928 Republican Convention opened with a prayer.

      If the Lord can see His way clear to bless the Republican Party the way it’s been carrying on, then the rest of us ought to get it without even asking.

      — Will Rogers (1879-1935) American humorist

  13. NobodySpecial says:

    So has the holy mother church decided that the only way to look good after covering up raping children is to stand next to republicans?
    Or has the republican party found someone it can look good next to?

    Either way isn’t particularly good for democracy.

    • orchidcup says:

      The more you observe politics, the more you’ve got to admit that each party is worse than the other.

      – Will Rogers (1879-1935) American humorist

  14. Invisible Sky-Daddy says:

    All this craziness for endless centuries because the vast majority of humans can’t deal with the fact that, sooner or later, every one of their precious little special asses is worm food.

  15. Martin says:

    How about this, Republicans should ban the Cardinal from doing his thing, and the DNC should ban the Muslim Brotherhood, Jumah Jumah thingy. Or is Shariah law consistent with Liberal ideas?….give me a break.

    Wouldn’t that be all better? You know, separation of church and state….anyone remember that?

    A little balance is required here folks.

    • orchidcup says:

      The separation of church and state is not a well understood concept, even though it is embodied in the First Amendment of the Constitution.

      Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should “make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,” thus building a wall of separation between church and State.

      — Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826), US Founding Father, drafted the Declaration of Independence, 3rd US President
      Source: letter to a Committee of the Danbury Baptist Association, Connecticut, January 1st 1802

    • Yep says:

      Funny how quiet the liberals get when pointing out that they are pandering to religion as well.

  16. JimD, Boston, MA says:

    Geez ! Dolan looks like he’s ready to explode ! I guess his is still pissed about all the money they had to pay out due to the BABY RAPERS THEY HARBORED !!! Serves you right, you hyp0crite !!!

  17. farmits says:

    Boo the hypocrite b-tard off the stage!

  18. kjb434 says:

    You do know the Democrats are also having Dolan perform a similar service at their convention….

  19. Egon Ruuda says:

    Gooby PLZ!!!

  20. Dallas says:

    All I say is a picture is worth a thousand words.

  21. Guyver says:

    So what?

    • GregAllen says:

      Tax exempt status is “so what?”

      The conservatives bishops are using the church to play politics.

      They needs to have their religion status changed to political.

  22. Jim says:

    worst part is, i would bet most pastors that actually have to work with the poor and normal people are a lot softer in their stands politically than the heirarchy. the nuns are also more sympathetic towards the dems because of working on the ground. I know my pastor has softened his political stands after working with a bunch of burmese catholic refugees, I know. so the biggest problem is maybe the bishops, arch-bishops, and cardinals have been too disconnected from the rest of the world to know what is going on.

    kind of ironic though, because when they made changes to the wordings in regular masses in November. the changes, according to my mom who used to teach sunday school for a while, harken back to the wordings promoted by Pope John 23rd, the pope who was for the longest time looked down upon by the top officials for things like Vatican 2, and his occasional sneaking out of the vatican offices in more humble clothing to spend time with the normal people on the street. and who set in motion the changes? Pope John Paul 2nd, as one of his last acts in his papacy.

  23. Marcin says:

    Cardinal Dolan was not invited to the Democratic National Convention but Democrats listed Muslim Jumah prayers as “official function.

    • GregAllen says:

      Why, in a million years, would they invite Dolan to their convention? He hates thinks we Democrats are Satan’s little helpers.

      As for giving Muslims a room to pray in — I’m fine with that. Any other religious group, too.

      What I’m not fine with is the anti-Muslim bigotry on right wing media today, about this.

  24. Marcin says:

    This just in:

    Timothy Cardinal Dolan, Archbishop of New York, has accepted an invitation to deliver the closing prayer at next week’s Democratic National Convention. As was previously announced, he will also be offering the closing prayer at the Republican Convention on Thursday of this week.

    So, Mr. Dworak I wonder if “The cozy relationship between a sizable portion of U.S. bishops and the Democratic Party should be cause for concern”?

  25. deowll says:

    It is my understanding that most Catholics voted Democrat. If you keep hate mongering maybe you can change that?

    • GregAllen says:


      I think most people here understand that there is a HUGE divide between the Catholic bishops and Catholics.

    • Gildersleeve says:

      That is correct – over the past 75 years Catholics have voted primarily Democrat. This became increasingly evident during FDR’s administration, when Catholics were primarily blue-collar. But today’s Democratic party are not the philosophical descendants of FDR – they act more like the ‘lunatic fringe’. Problem is, so does the Republican party. We used to elect Democrats because they appeared to run the government better than the Republicans. It’s clear NEITHER does now.

      Meanwhile, the Catholic bishops are tending to side with the party that shares *something* with them, and that is primarily the stand on abortion. There is little else to work with. Neither side provides a coherent strategy for dealing with fiscal, social or moral issues, so if the bishops appear to be taking sides, don’t get too worked up over it. You play the cards you’re dealt, and the hand stinks.

      • I love RCC says:

        Yet, when Obama set the mandate in motion to allow those immigrants who were brought here while children having grown up here in the USA, the bishops commended him for that action. That doesn’t sound biased to me, but we didn’t hear anything positive about that in the media, now did we.

  26. NewformatSux says:

    Almighty God, who gives us the sacred and inalienable gift of life, we thank you as well for the singular gift of liberty. Renew in all of our people a respect for religious freedom in full, that first most cherished freedom. Make us truly free by tethering freedom to truth and ordering freedom to goodness. Help us live our freedom in faith, hope and love, prudently and with justice, courageously and in a spirit of moderation. Enkindle in our hearts a new sense of responsibility for freedom’s cause and make us ever grateful for all those who for more than two centuries have given their lives in freedom’s defense. We commend their noble souls to your eternal care as even now we beg your mighty hand upon our beloved men and women in uniform. May we know the truth of your creation, respecting the laws of nature and nature’s God and not seek to replace it with idols of our own making.


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