150 years ago brave Americans under President Abraham Lincoln fought and died in a bloody war so that all people can be free and equal. We won that war – so why is it that in the 21st century that the South still hasn’t got the message?

The Confederate Flag is to black people what the Nazi flag is to Jews. It sends a message that blacks aren’t really free and equal members of society. For 150 years we have been pretending black people are free and equal while the truth is that we still have white supremacist states and a white supremacist culture where we allow the symbols of hate to be the symbols of government. When South Caroline flies the Confederate flag they are sending the message that the nig__rs better stay in their place.

But there is a new tool in place to fight the racist culture. On June 18th in the case of Walker v. Sons of Confederate Veterans that vehicle license plates were government speech and the government should not be demeaning black people. Based on this decision it’s time to start suing states over the use of the Confederate flag and at least get rid of what is clearly government sponsored racism.

  1. orchidcup says:

    Government sponsored racism is a long cherished tradition in this society.

    If racism were not present at all levels of society, what would be the topic of discussion on the cable news channels?

    Are we expecting the cable news channels to discuss news topics?

    Prepare to be bored.

    • Now Serffing America says:

      Absolutely! What will the “news” talk about if racism and celebrities weren’t topics? The boring old TPP that Washington and big business are trying to ram down everyone’s throat?

      FYI: If the TPP (Trans Pacific Partnership) is signed, which is appears that it will, you can expect to see a world wide economic tail spin the likes of which will make the dark ages seem luxurious. But don’t expect anyone in the news to talk about it. Psssst! That kind of stuff is “big business” that the big news agencies don’t think you should know about — because it’s too boring.

  2. Tommy says:

    Perkel is against free speech.

    • nobabyno says:

      naw. tom you still can hang your flag from a tree, but mississippi shouldn’t.

  3. orchidcup says:

    “The Confederate Flag is to black people what the Nazi flag is to Jews.”

    The mass extermination of Jews is not equivalent to the mass enslavement of Africans.

    There were many more Africans enslaved prior to the American Civil War than there were Jews exterminated during the Second World War.

    Nevertheless, slavery was accepted as an institution prior to the American Civil War predominately because of Christian religious beliefs. The King James Bible supports the idea of slavery in the Old Testament as well as the New Testament.

    The concept of slavery and/or indentured servitude is supported by most religious belief systems.

    If God expects us to accept slavery and indentured servitude as essential to the operation of a society, we should not question the wisdom of the Almighty.

    The Confederate flag is a symbol of our obedience to Biblical principles.

    • Now Serffing America says:

      That is some of the most twisted logic I’ve seen in quite some time. (Maybe that’s your point?)

      The Confederate flag has nothing to do with Biblical teachings whatsoever. It has everything to do with conquest and power — just like our current ‘Ol Glory, or just about any national flag does.

      FYI: Slavery in America had existed for well over 200 years by the time it became a hot political issue (which really started in the 1840’s). Estimates have been made where slaves had been summarily executed just on the trip from Africa to America alone. Those conservative estimates backed by real physical evidence tell us that well over 10 million people were killed from things like avoidable diseases, starvation, thirst, corporal punishment, etc. I won’t even go into the well known horrors or the increase in death numbers once those slaves arrived! So saying that the Nazi’s were somehow worse, just because it was more recent or something, is absurd. Quite frankly, the holocaust pales by comparison.

      You might also note that the Civil War really began when a few southern states decided to secede from the Union (Federal Govt.). Originally, it had nothing to do with slavery! In fact, the Civil War started over oppression from rich northern states that wanted to extract more money from the poorer southern ones. (Sound familiar?) Slavery only became an issue AFTER the shooting had already started. In fact, Lincoln’s Emancipation Proclamation didn’t become the 13th Amendment until after the war was pretty much over (December 1865). And still, some states hadn’t ratified it. In fact, the last state to ratify the 13th Amendment was Mississippi which did it in 1995!

      But yes! The Bible does tell us that slaves are OK. It just doesn’t tell us very well how to TREAT slaves (unless you think that any of Moses’ Ten Commandments apply or something).

      • orchidcup says:

        Twisted logic is the domain of all religious beliefs.

        Aside from that, historians may argue the precise causes of the Civil War conflict, but there is a general consensus that slavery was not the primary focus of the conflict between the states.

        • Reality Check says:

          YOU are one sick, twisted, head case.

          How did you get this way?

          • orchidcup says:

            I studied the Bible.

          • Reality Check says:

            And there you have it. You read only what you wanted to read.

          • Average Random Joe says:

            “Twisted logic is the domain of all religious beliefs.”

            Reality Check, don’t forget, atheism is a religious belief too so he is actually including himself and has already answered you. Although, “extreme” should have been inserted between “all” and “religious” to be technically accurate.

  4. Now Serffing America says:

    The Confederate flag isn’t aimed at just African American’s. These days, it’s aimed at ALL Americans!

    In case it isn’t clear, government authorities think that ALL U.S. Citizens are little more than a bunch of n__gers! And who’s to say they’re wrong when we keep putting these authorities in power? I mean, what are we serfs supposed to do after we’ve allowed them to do things they’ve done like ignore parts of the U.S. Constitution (particularly, the 4th Amendment), impose illegal taxes, and allow big business crime & corruption as well their own little scandals to go unpunished, etc.?!

    BTW, the Civil War wasn’t fought to free slaves. Not at first! In fact, the Emancipation Proclamation (13th Amendment) was signed for 2 reasons — to infuriate the rebels and as a symbolic gesture. It wasn’t even ratified until well after the war was over. Today, it would be like the U.S. enacting a law saying there will be no more vodka in Russia.

    • orchidcup says:

      Indeed, the American Civil War was more about state sovereignty than the institution of slavery.

      Nevertheless, if each state in a union claims sovereignty above the federal government, then we are faced with the situation where a state such as Colorado, for example, could legalize marijuana, for example, in defiance of federal laws that criminalize the substance.

      If a significant number of sovereign states were to legalize marijuana, for example, in defiance of federal laws to the contrary, then the stage would be set for another Civil War if the federal authorities decided to subjugate the will of the people by the use of violent force.

      But of course, nothing like that would ever happen.

      • NewFormatSux says:

        The Southern states had no reason to secede if the issue was slavery. 15 slaves states is enough to block a constitutional amendment even today, and at the time it was approximately an even split. The Southern states dominated the Democratic party, which in turn blocked all anti-slavery bills. There was no reason for them to leave over Lincoln’s election.

        The real reason for secession was because they were upset over tariffs. Europe was countering the US manufacturing tariffs with tariffs on US exports, primarily from the South.

      • Now Serffing America says:

        That’s a ridiculous sentence: … if each state in a UNION claims SOVEREIGNTY …


        Please understand that a UNION is a conglomeration or COLLECTION of (insert noun here) bound by the same common agreed attribute and/or agenda. In this case, the “Union” IS the Federal Government which is made up of all 50 states! Therefore, if each member in the union is all of a sudden independently sovereign (like Brazil or somewhere) then there is NO UNION!

        … And your argument about Colorado imposing marijuana laws over the rest of the nation is even more absurd. Here’s something you probably didn’t realize: In Colorado, possession and consumption of marijuana is STILL ILLEGAL and can even be prosecuted in Colorado under federal law — just not by Colorado officials. You clearly don’t understand how laws work nor what “States Rights” are or even the process of ratifying new national laws. Hint: try looking into the 18th and 21st Amendments to see how it’s done in America. Or even the EUROPEAN UNION to see how a less central, more powerful independent STATES RIGHTS system works.

        • NewFormatSux says:

          In the same post you say a union can’t be that and then you point to the European UNION.

  5. NewFormatSux says:

    Swastikas can be seen in some countries, built into the design of buildings, with no Nazi intent. Should these go?

    • orchidcup says:

      So long as there is no inherent Nazi intent in the design of the Swastika, which is a universal symbol of many cultures, then such a design should be allowed with a legal disclaimer to that effect.

  6. Tommy says:

    Lincoln was a racist. True he despised slavery, but he DID NOT believe the races were equal. In fact he wanted to deport blacks back to Africa.

    “In their fourth debate, at Charleston, Illinois, on September 18, 1858, Lincoln made his position clear. “I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races,” he began, going on to say that he opposed blacks having the right to vote, to serve on juries, to hold office and to intermarry with whites.”

    “For much of his career, Lincoln believed that colonization—or the idea that a majority of the African-American population should leave the United States and settle in Africa or Central America—was the best way to confront the problem of slavery.”

    • orchidcup says:

      Lincoln’s proposal remains a valid solution for the racism that permeates all societies.

      Let each group of silly hoomans that identify as a certain racial history occupy a land that is exclusive to each group.

      Each group must remain confined within the borders of their own land, and no travel or other social intercourse should be allowed between the racial groups.

      This arrangement, as suggested by President Lincoln, is the only logical solution that would preserve peace in the world.

      Otherwise, we are faced with continual violent conflict until only one race of humans survives long enough to colonize other planets in the universe.

  7. mojo says:

    Oh, boo-hoo.

    It’s a piece of cloth.

    • orchidcup says:

      A handkerchief is a piece of cloth.

      A flag is a symbol that inspires emotions in the psyche of silly hoomans.

      A symbol unites the ideology of a group of people according to the personal understanding of each member of that group.

      A symbol may not represent exactly the same meaning to each individual in a group, but there are universal meanings that are communicated by certain symbols to all members of a group.

      Not all groups of silly hoomans interpret a symbol in the same way.

      However, in the Deep South, a Confederate flag is a symbol that glorifies White Supremacy to most members in that particular group.

      For most people that populate this planet, the symbol of the Confederate flag is pretty much meaningless.

  8. orchidcup says:

    “— Americans under President Abraham Lincoln fought and died in a bloody war so that all people can be free and equal. We won that war – “

    Who is the collective “we” that you reference in that statement?

    If you are a resident of a northern state that joined the federal side of the conflict, perhaps the statement is accurate.

    However, there are a number of people that populate the southern states that disagree with the ideology that “all men are created equal.” Many will disagree with the ideology that “all men should be free.”

    There remains an ideology in this country that some races are superior to others, for example, or that only white Christian men deserve to be free, as another example. The Klu Klux Klan is but one example of an ideology that does not conform to the generalized concept of “free and equal.”

    The outcome of the American Civil War did not settle the issue of racial equality in the minds of many on the losing side of the war. As we know from the Civil Rights movement of the 60’s and going forward, many issues of equality and freedom are yet to be settled.

    • NewFormatSux says:

      There was an earlier voting rights act passed after the Civil War. It was repealed as soon as the South got their guys into power again, in the 1890s. Other than that Grover Cleveland was a good President.
      Found out during the NBA finals that the city is not named after the President.

  9. NewFormatSux says:

    That flag you posted is not any of the three flags of the Confederacy. It is close to the second one, but that had this battle flag in one corner on a field of white.

  10. Eideard says:

    Overdue. By decades.

  11. John Ullman says:

    The South may have lost the war, but slavery didn’t. It would be nice if the Confederate flag went away, but the issue for us is slavery 2.0. McDonalds, for example, paying just little enough to people qualify for food stamps and other government aid. McDonald’s slavery is tax payer subsidized. As far as I’m concerned, the golden arches are a lot more sinister than the Confederate flag.

    The same type of psychopaths who were happy owning slaves are now happy to legislate conditions which get the most work out of people for the pay, and once they’re squeezed dry, deny them health care so they die quickly.

    • McCullough says:

      Then don’t work at McDonald’ s. It’s not a skill you know. Want to work in food service, go to mixology school and be a bartender. Some of my best friends are bartenders and make 70k and up per year. Or be a waiter in a decent restaurant.

      You just cannot expect to make a living cooking french fries, its a job for teenagers after school.

      Sorry but that’s just reality.

      Oh and by the way, when I was in the military, working upwards of 100 hours a week…I was eligible for food stamps. Didn’t take it, but I was eligible.

    • SKINET says:

      In reality, fast food is highly competitive. We have several options, which is the way the press used to operate. Actually the writers could learn from the cooks. With the writers and no competition, more people are going to starve. We had three papers and now we have one and a McDonalds, Burger King and Subway. There are a dozen pizza shops too and KFC and Sonic along with Popeyes.

  12. SKINET says:

    “This blizzard of mind-warping war propaganda out of Washington is building up steam. Monday is Anthrax, Tuesday is Bankruptcy, Friday is Child-Rape, Thursday is Bomb-scares, etc., etc., etc… If we believed all the brutal, frat-boy threats coming out of the White House, we would be dead before Sunday. It is pure and savage terrorism reminiscent of Nazi Germany.”
    “Domestic terrorism at the Super Bowl” (11 February 2002)

    The way things are going they’ll be flying the Nazi Germany flag because Saturday is Liquidation.

  13. Daniël Bos says:

    I suggest you read “The Real Lincoln” before posting the party line…

    Lincoln was a brutal dictator that started the whole “let’s shit on the constitution” craze. On numerous occasions he voiced his support for slavery and segregation.

    He only “freed” the slaves in the South, two years into the war, in the hopes it would lead to a rebellion. As a result, around 100k soldiers in the North deserted, because the refused to fight “to free the Negro”. He *didn’t* free the slaves in Northern controlled territories though.

    He did censor every newspaper that criticized his blatant violations of the Constitution. He also jailed the editors without charge. He started the mass surveillance of the public, by tapping and censoring all telegraph communication. He massively increased taxes and instituted a federal income tax. He single-handedly dragged America into the corrupt mercantilism system we know today, where special interest groups and corporations can buy the legislation they like with “donations”

    And that was all in the North…

    In the South he shelled entire cities, women, children and slaves included, to set an example. Villages where looted and burned to the ground as policy. Billions were looted and destroyed.

    Slavery in the US was ended *despite* Lincoln’s war on the Constitution and State Rights, not *because* of it.

    • Sombody says:

      Guy kind of stole my thunder but here goes:

      “150 years ago brave Americans under President Abraham Lincoln fought and died in a bloody war so that all people can be free and equal.”

      Read any of the Lincoln books by Thomas DiLorenzo and you’ll come to a different conclusion, unless, of course, you are impervious to facts.

      The Gettysburg Address, while moving and poetic, was actually quite bizarre given the context in which it was given and by whom it was given.

      Rather than to free the blacks, the goal of the War of Northern Aggression was to enslave the states and their occupants, putting the Southern states under military occupation and changing the Union from a democratic, lawful & consensual alliance into an empire of right through might. Note that congress never declared the war so it was illegal and if Lincoln truly believed that the Southern States were part of the US, making war on them was clearly treason according to the Constitution.

      The genocide of the Native Americans was a fitting encore and involved many of the same “heroes”.

      Incidentally, the first people attacked by the US Army (after ratification of the Constitution) were Americans and the cause was, again, taxation.

      • SKINET says:

        “The Gettysburg speech was at once the shortest and the most famous oration in American history… But let us not forget that it is poetry, not logic; beauty, not sense. Think of the argument in it! Put it into the cold words of everyday! The doctrine is simply this: that the Union soldiers who died at Gettysburg sacrificed their lives to the cause of self-determination – “that government of the people, by the people, for the people, should not perish from the earth”. It is difficult to imagine anything more untrue. The Union soldiers in the battle actually fought against self-determination; it was the Confederates who fought for the right of their people to govern themselves.”
        Prejudices, Third Series (1922) H.L. Mencken

        It looks like the new battleground is the church and state house, places that were formerly off limits to combat operations. This is going to whip up newspaper sales as the running battles and riots heat up. Avoid the area.

      • McCullough says:

        So if the Confederate flag is an affront to blacks then it must be true that the US Flag is an affront to the American Indian….and therefore it must be banned.

    • Ah_Yea says:

      Slavery in the US was ended *despite* Lincoln’s war on the Constitution and State Rights, not *because* of it.

      Exactly right. Long time ago my college history teacher taught the true reason why slavery ended.

      Obsolescence. Slavery was too expensive compared to the cotton gin and the steam tractor. Lincoln didn’t free the slaves as much as Eli Whitney.

      Not to mention, life in the North was often MUCH worse for blacks than in the south.

      • bobbo, in point of fact says:

        Demonstrating an uncritical acceptance of what he was first told ((and hasn’t thought since, if then)

        Ah_Yea says:
        6/20/2015 at 11:03 pm

        Slavery in the US was ended *despite* Lincoln’s war on the Constitution and State Rights, not *because* of it.

        Exactly right. Long time ago my college history teacher taught the true reason why slavery ended. /// Slavery ended because of the CW and the 14th Amendment. PERIOD. Now…not to be confused with the alternate scenario of how long slavery would have lasted if THE CIVIL WAR HAD NOT ENDED IT FIRST.

        Obsolescence. Slavery was too expensive compared to the cotton gin and the steam tractor. /// Well, then…. why did the South seceed then? Not good business men?

        Lincoln didn’t free the slaves as much as Eli Whitney. /// yeah….”if” there was an alternate reality to the history of the thing. You know…in similar vein…. it wasn’t Eli Whitney but rather Dupont who invented polyester. Polyester freed the slaves.

        Not to mention, life in the North was often MUCH worse for blacks than in the south. /// How that? You mean it was colder? Slavery existed in the North….the existences of 100Plus enslaved work forces with oversears not as prevelant. Kinda depends on what you call better or worse?

        Reply /// Childlike in what you post.

        • NewFormatSux says:

          The cotton gin extended slavery, making it economically more feasible.

          The 14th Amendment didn’t end slavery. You meant the 13th, and that was just in the US.

          Even in the 1920s, Egypt was taking white slaves from Europe. The word ‘slave’ comes from Slav as in Yugoslavia.

          And then there are the wars in Africa which has caused slavery right now.

  14. SKINET says:

    In Flemming v. Nestor (1960), the Supreme Court ruled that workers have no legal right to Social Security: Congress can cut or eliminate Social Security benefits at any time regardless of a worker’s contributions.

    Like George Carlin said, they’re taking back your pensions and coming for your Social Security. They own all the important property and they own you. The politicians are there to make it look like you have a choice. You don’t. You’ll be liquidated and any property you owned will be converted into debt. That’ll go toward fighting the war on terror. It’s a fire sale and everything must go. Resist and they’ll get you some trumped up charge or claim you did or didn’t comply with this or that. Maybe all the empty churches will be processing centers. We are all black now.

  15. bobbo, in point of fact says:

    orchidcup says:
    6/20/2015 at 10:36 am

    Twisted logic is the domain of all religious beliefs.

    Aside from that, historians may argue the precise causes of the Civil War conflict, but there is a general consensus that slavery was not the primary focus of the conflict between the states.

    ///////////////// Apply your twisting logic skills to this: South Carolina Succession Document says they are seceeding for the purpose of keeping the right to keep slaves. Several other Southern states says this outright and explicitly as well…along with the code words of maintaining States Rights but the only right at issue is the right to keep slaves.

    Seems to me the Civil War required two elements: A: The South initiating the CW by firing on Fort Sumptner and then formally seceeding, and

    B: The North deciding they weren’t going to allow succession regardless of the reasons given.

    Get it?

    NOT EITHER/OR…… but rather TWO, count them: 1 + 1=2 factors. I know. Twice as many factors as you can handle. ((HHICMSU!)

    As to the Flag===just how many “winning” sides allow the losing side to maintain symbols of revolution? Only in America. Same with Guns…… only in America (sic).

    …………..and the Pope. His encyclical is ONLY important/relevant against the argument with religious/religious using types that want to quote the Pope/Church/Religion/God as being Pro Big Oil.

    Makes me wonder how many issues the majority of people can be so wrong headed about and still function.

    ………………………………..did I say: function?

    Ha, ha. I Crack My Self Up (No help needed Tolly!)

    • SKINET says:

      “Apollo also demonstrates the extremes to which a free country will go to keep alive the spirit of capitalism. It is in a different category from the Russian space effort, which is in the grand tradition of the Pyramids, another example of an enormous folly built by a totalitarian state for self-glorification. Such an explanation will not suffice in freedom-loving America.”

      Politics does not have to be the art of the possible, it can be the art of the impossible and transporting thousands of freedom loving Americans to Mars on the SpaceX ships.

    • NewFormatSux says:

      Those secession documents were only ever voted on by a small number of people. And you will note the Georgia document goes into more detail on the tariff issue.
      Slavery was an issue between the two, but secession gained them nothing. Their primary complaint was the fugitive slave act was not being enforced. Well the escaped slaves weren’t going to returned after secession either.

      • bobbo, in point of fact says:

        Those secession documents were only ever voted on by a small number of people. /// Yes, like the Constitution or Bill of Rights and any other document/gubment action you can name. Whats your point that withstands any analysis at all?

        And you will note the Georgia document goes into more detail on the tariff issue. /// So—wanting to keep slaves becomes irrelevant because they mentioned something else?…… really????

        Slavery was an issue between the two, but secession gained them nothing. /// It gained them the right to be self governing. It was failing to win the war that gained them nothing.

        Their primary complaint was the fugitive slave act was not being enforced. //// Like Oh No…I was taught in High School it was the defeat of the Kansas Something act that was going to expand slave states Westward.

        Well the escaped slaves weren’t going to returned after secession either. /// Your point appears to be the secession Idea was flawed from the start? Not so…had they succeeded. But they failed.

        Watch that ball….. it bounces.

  16. SKINET says:

    ” As we’ve found out over the years, the Greys never “spoon-feed” us information. They make us work for it, but what a great way to expand our consciousness, which is what human evolution is all about!”

    They’re stuck in the middle 1800’s. Russia has bikers stuck in Soviet 1980’s building Mad Max tanker trucks. We need to plan to leave Earth for Mars and plan on not coming back.

  17. Rich says:

    BULL-SHIT. I think the Rebel Jack stands more for let’s say David vs Goliath, or the spirit oif the South, or the underdog, or the resistance to an ever-growing totalitarian Federal government. Useless, muck-raking, race-baiting blacks like Sharpton (and many others who fart from their mouths professionally) care about this, and blacks who have an agenda care, and thoughtless ones, and lefties in general. I think it’s time South Carolina and Dixie in general stand up to these monsters and kick them in the butt. I saw one flying locally not too long ago and honked my horn.

    • bobbo, in point of fact says:

      Mindless drivel.

      Explain how the David vs Goliath metaphor fits except in half measures or by reversing its meaning….aka…another way of saying it doesn’t fit at all.

      Kinda like Southern intelligence.

  18. NewFormatSux says:

    South Carolina doesn’t fly the Confederate flag. They have it at a memorial for Confederate soldiers.

    • Card-carrying Mensa member says:

      The Confederate flag flies at separate memorial on the grounds of the South Carolina Capitol.

      What really stood out was, after the shooting incident, the U.S. and S.C. flags flew at half-staff above the Capitol dome, while the Confederate flag remained at the top of its pole.

      No sympathy for dead black folks from the Confederates, or so it would appear…

  19. ECA says:

    Want some truth in this….
    The war was started over the use and export of cotton..

  20. spsffan says:

    Actually, Lincoln didn’t start the “shitting on the Constitution”. That was done under John Adams. But Lincoln changed it from more of an occasional mistake into more of a sport.

    Now, from where I sit, if the slave states wanted to leave, I’d say “Don’t let the door hit you on your way out.” and proceed to make some proper, yellow, sweet cornbread. :).

  21. Pat Brady and Bullet says:

    Such are humans. (Note the correct spelling of the third word, if you are illiterate).

    • bobbo, in point of fact says:

      Maybe……………if some word is spelled differently………its not the word you are thinking of?

      ((…………..or its a phonetic representation.))

  22. NewFormatSux says:

    So when is Perkel going to complain about Obama meeting with and speaking to La Raza?

  23. Will Matchinski says:

    I click on, “85 Comments,” I see only one comment left by NewFormatSux. What went wrong?


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