This is a pretty amazing interview. Snowden has impressive convictions. Putin seems to have a lot of respect for Snowden and frustrated what a screw up Obama was in dealing with it.

This is what I love about Snowden. He’s living on asylum in Russia and yet he has no fear of confronting Putin about Russian spying.

  1. ± says:

    After many months, the narrative is proffered. Totally scripted. Thanks for being a vector (and with breathless enthusiasm, no less).     🙄

  2. Dude'nt says:

    Don’t you just love all this misdirection?

    Hardly anyone is talking about the Watergate-like crimes committed at the DNC convention, or how badly Bernie got shafted. Almost no one is focused on America’s number one CRIMINAL — Hillary Clinton. And as far as America speeding towards a certain financial cliff, I’ve heard nothing. Have you?!

    So let’s all hold hands and walk into that abyss. Let’s all blame Russia for America’s problems — since the press and the lunatic left is telling us to. Maybe we’ll get lucky and provoke a nuclear war before anyone wakes up.

    • NewFormatSux says:

      Bernie wasn’t shafted. He was a Clinton agent just as Snowden is Putin agent.

      • ± says:

        How do you mean that Bernie is a Clinton agent?

      • Ah_Yea says:

        Assuming Bernie was a Clinton agent, doesn’t this tell how deeply and absolutely corrupt the DNC is that they had to put up a straw man just to look legit??

        • NewFormatSux says:

          Republicans have been doing the same thing. Conservatives keep getting upset with their choices and feel that the liberal is winning because of it. McCain won lots of primaries with small pluralities to win big. Romney had only Santorum who conservatives didn’t like but still nearly toppled him. This time, they tried to put in Jeb by splitting the opposition so many ways, but Trump came in and took him down with ‘Oh yea, you’re real tough’.

          • Ah_Yea says:

            Yea, now that you mention it both sides do it. I now remember the whole plan how the Repubs maneuvered the Presidential candidates this last election to get Jeb! to win.
            Oops! Trumped!!

  3. Hmeyers says:

    Very good video, thanks Marc.

    Interesting story about how Snowden ended up in Russia and how the US was trying to strong arm everyone.

  4. Ah_Yea says:

    BTW great video. Putin comes off MUCH more intelligent and sanguine than our current Constitutional Scholar.
    Even if it’s scripted, Putin pulls it off much better.

    • ± says:

      “Even if it’s scripted …”

      You can’t be serious. Like there is some doubt.        🙄

      • Ah_Yea says:

        “Even if it’s scripted” is another way of saying “Given that it’s scripted”.

        In other words, Putin presents himself as much more genuine, and far less of an elitist.

        It may not be truth, but the best actor usually wins. Kennedy vs. Nixon, Regan vs. Mondale, Trump vs. Hillary, Putin vs. Obama.

        It’s all about optics.

  5. OmegaProject says:

    The US and Russia should exchange Hillary for Snowden..

  6. Phydeau says:

    While y’all are swooning over Putin, the FBI agrees with the CIA that Russia intervened in the US election to get Trump elected.

    And somehow, you are OK with that. Why do you hate what America stands for? Why do you hate democracy, and freedom from foreign influence? As long as your guy gets “elected”, you don’t care how dirty it was.

    Y’all are disgusting. 🙄

    FBI Director James B. Comey and Director of National Intelligence James R. Clapper Jr. are in agreement with a CIA assessment that Russia intervened in the 2016 election in part to help Donald Trump win the White House, officials disclosed Friday, as President Obama issued a public warning to Moscow that it could face retaliation.

    • Five Stages of Good Grief says:

      I sense you’re in an endless loop between grief stages 1 through 3:

      1. Denial.
      2. Anger.
      3. Bargaining.
      4. Depression.
      5. Acceptance.

      Example: “As long as your guy gets ‘elected’, you don’t care how dirty it was.”

      Are you kidding? How rich! Did you forget all the Dem tricks?

      It’s now officially Game, Set, Match.

      So Charlie Brown, how can we help you break through to stage 5?

      • Phydeau says:

        Yeah, you go with that. Whatever helps you sleep at night. Your guy got elected with the help of a hostile foreign government. And now he’s putting rich Republican fat cats, billionaires, and Wall Street insiders in charge of the government. He’s not draining the swamp, he’s building a high-rise swamp with “TRUMP” in big gold letters.

        You been conned, and you can’t admit it. Look in the mirror when you talk about stages of grief, pal. 😉

        • Phydeau says:

          Anyone? Bueller? Didn’t think so. Run away, wingnuts. Start practicing those stories of how you didn’t vote for Trump, that you knew he was bad from the start. 🙄 🙄 🙄

        • NewFormatSux says:

          I’m curious why you think they support Trump, when Trump’s energy plans would bankrupt their country. Expanding fracking, opening up drilling on federal lands, more coal production, would all lower prices on Russia’s number one source of income.
          Why would they prefer that to a President that they bribed to take control of uranium in America?

    • NewFormatSux says:

      So why aren’t they giving Congress a briefing in closes session as requested? Should someone be fired for this refusal?

    • NewFormatSux says:

      I love freedom from foreign influence, so I went with the candidate that will put judges that give no weight to opinions of foreign judges. Hillary also supports International Criminal Court and EU.

      • Phydeau says:

        I gotta give you credit for trying, NFS. All the rest of your fellow Trumpbot wingnuts have run for the hills. No doubt practicing their stories of how they opposed Trump from the beginning. 🙄

        Buyer’s remorse, it kinda sucks, doesn’t it, guys? 😀

        • Hmeyers says:

          No matter what happens, one thing is for sure.

          The Democratic Party will have start fighting for needs of people in the Midwest.

          Places like Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Youngstown, Akron, Canton, Detroit and several other Michigan cities, Milwaukee have been devastated by NAFTA.

          The Democrats didn’t care before.

          Now they got stung by abandoning the working class in Midwest, that will change.

          The best political arrangement is having 2 parties fight for your vote.

          No matter what happens: Both parties will be fighting for the Midwest vote. It’s a win-win for the Midwest.

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            Say HM: how fast, how often do you have to lower your appreciation of “winning” to say there is “any” for the Midwest?

            “I have more useless scraps than you do. I win.”

          • Hmeyers says:

            Bobbo, I hope you have Merry Christmas.

            After a disappointing warm winter last year, we have some negative degrees windchill going on here in Ohio from time to time.

            Since, I like the cold and like snow, I’m rather pleased.

          • Phydeau says:

            No matter what happens, we are going to get screwed by the billionaires, plutocrats, Republican Fat Cats and Wall Street Insiders that Trump has appointed to run the government. Thanks to you idjits who were conned by his line of BS.

            Shame on you.

          • Hmeyers says:

            “Shame on you”


            This means you have correctly determined that, I, myself decided the election.

            Which fits perfectly with my worldview that I have a disproportionate “say” in all matters of the world.

            I thank you for your keen observations.

          • Hmeyers says:

            Bobbo, check this out …

            Snow falls in the Sahara desert for first time since 1879 …


          • Mr Diesel says:

            Global Warming

            No wait, Global Cooling

            No wait, Climate Change

            That’s the ticket and it will cover any bullshit we want it to cover.

            Too many tornadoes – Climate Change
            Too few tornadoes – Climate Change
            Too many hurricanes – Climate Change
            Too few hurricanes – Climate Change
            etc etc etc

            Snow in the Sahara – George Bush’s fault

          • Phydeau says:

            Hmeyers, take responsibility for your actions. If you voted for Trump, shame on you for being conned. If you didn’t, please ignore that post.

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            Well thanks HM===>and a hearty return to you and yours and to all else with nothing better to do who find themselves here. I’m honestly trying to “stay away” from the lackluster comments found here…but yours are always engaging.

            My impression is that this winter is colder than many previous ones…. having to wrap plants against the freezing nights………..BUT ….. as McCullough is a prime example of, human observation is…………. “faulty” at best.

            I’ll try to remember the few colder nights as next summer has record breaking days over 100 in a row again.

            ……………….. you know: averages. Boring things.

          • Hmeyers says:


            Yeah, the comments have been a bit on the bland side lately, but with such a bizarre and long election just naturally fits.

            What I’d really like is some scientific discovery news or a breakthrough in battery technology.

          • NewFormatSux says:

            HMeyers, they said Trump will win the presidency when Hell freezes over. This is pretty close.


          • NewFormatSux says:

            Regarding the MidWest, Jay Cost wrote about this before the 2012 election. It was strange seeing him make calls for Mitt Romney to serve his country one more time, when the analytic minded Cost should have seen that Trump was doing exactly what Cost wanted.

          • Hmeyers says:

            New format …

            Yes, I was going for the “when the hell freezes over” angle.

            It’s been that kind of year of strange year.

            Maybe Assange will get pardoned or something.

            Wouldn’t mind seeing Snowden pardoned, but I know it will never, ever happen.

          • NewFormatSux says:

            Extreme heat kills less than moderate cold. We need more global warming!


          • ± says:

            This thread is thick with D/R hiring scum pecking at each other. Why “scum”?; it is a polite word for people who install the R/D governance that will eventually destroy the country. There are 100s of millions of electorate scum.

            To the rest of us who try to make a change at the polls, you guys are so trite and silly arguing over the new arrangement of the deck chairs on the Titanic.

  7. bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

    Diesel……I still opine that your aren’t an idiot…… so let me pose the following question to you: what will happen to an atmosphere as you increase the proportion of green house gases to it?

    As compared to previous history….will the temperatures constantly and steadily always go up everywhere?===>or will there be variability as the average goes up?

    You know: ……………….. think………… fer Christs sake.

    • Hmeyers says:

      The Venus analogy has actually been demonstrate to not correlate very well to Earth.

      Did you know the atmosphere of Venus is 93 times more massive than the Earth’s?

      It is said the Earth lost most of its atmosphere in an ancient collision. And had this collision not happened, the Earth would have a massive and thick atmosphere like Venus.

    • Mr Diesel says:

      Well, if someone said that all the greenhouse gasses were caused by man I’d just call bullshit.

      Now if anyone who has a passing interest in man caused pollution and what the US has done to reduce it I merely ask that you look at pictures of various cities in the US from the the first half of the last century and compare them with today. LA is an exception, live in a non-flushing toilet and expect shit to hang around.

    • James says:

      Remember peak oil? Remember Ebola? Remember Zika. Remember that idiot Al Gore who invented nothing, and got most everything wrong.

      The sky might be falling, but it might not. And your scientists just might be wrong. Computer model are not that good.

      It does happen.

  8. bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

    I have no interest in hijacking this OP to AGW….but responding to direct questions…………….. HM………….I can’t make any sense at all out of “The Venus analogy has actually been demonstrate to not correlate very well to Earth.” My thoughts on Venus analogy is limited to the notion that a planet within the reach of a sun will heat up it some proportion to the percentage of green house gases that make up its atmosphere? Is that a correlation>…………. or a CAUSATION? Always of note: causation has a 100% correlation to its effect?

    Interesting………eh wot?

  9. NewFormatSux says:

    Phydeau, if NeverTrumpers knew what Trump would do since Election Day, he’d have won even more states.

    • NewFormatSux says:

      Although I agree that Trump’s voters would prefer Trump and Bernie humiliate Mitch McConnell than Trump and McConnell humiliate Bernie.

    • Phydeau says:

      Really? Trump is assembling a team of Wall Street Insiders, fat cat Republicans and Billionaires, and you think blue-collar workers would support that?

      Dang, I wish this blog had a way of filtering people, or just tagging them “INSANE”. 🙄 🙄

      • Hmeyers says:

        If you want to put a rocket into space, you want Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos or Richard Branson.

        If you want a tech product, you wanted a Bill Gates, Steve Jobs or Eric Schmidt.

        It is quite possible that the people that Trump has selected may be the right kind of people to “get things done”.

        Only time will tell.

        Surely not a Phydeau rant. You aren’t exactly someone with a neutral point of view.

        I myself have not been very impressed with your prognostication skills.

        Not that mine are great, but I’m wise enough to not make prognostications at all.

        Since you seemed to be just fine with Hillary as the nominee, I would say that not only are your prognostication skills quite poor but that you also have extremely bad taste.

        One of Sanders people said on November 9th after Hillary lost: “A ham sandwich could have been beaten Trump … but Hillary couldn’t beat him.”

        Do you really think Obama was all that surprised that Hillary could fuck up an election? She was great at fucking up everything from Benghazi to her email server to wasting $1.2 billion dollars and campaigning in the wrong states.

        • NewFormatSux says:

          Wasn’t Phydeau here lecturing us Trump voters for that black church that was burned with Vote Trump written on it? Turns out it was a hoax as we suspected. Member of the church was responsible.

      • NewFormatSux says:

        You been taking reading comprehension lessons from bobbo? I said NeverTrumpers. They are not blue collar. They are the guys who think it’s horrible that Trump got Carrier to keep some jobs here, because they could get the work done cheaper elsewhere. And yes, the support having billionaires, Goldman Sachs, yada yada yada.

      • ± says:

        ****** offered Phydeau with typical alacrity **************
        Dang, I wish this blog had a way of filtering people, or just tagging them “INSANE”. 🙄 🙄

        This has to be one of the most thoughtlessly ironic statements ever uttered here.               :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

        • Phydeau says:

          Yeah, where you been, plusminus, while your hero Trump has appointed billionaires, fat cat Republicans, and Wall Street insiders to run the country? You ran away and hid, coward. Just like most of your wingnut buddies. Only good ol’ insane NFS stayed to try to defend Trump.

          Y’all are becoming a bunch of little pedritos — empty snarky insults are all you got now.

          Run along, wingnut. You got nothing.

          • Don Q says:

            I’m afraid you’re the wingnut, “pal”.

            Take a deep breath. And stop tilting at windmills.

          • NewFormatSux says:

            > empty snarky insults are all you got now.

            I’m noticing a lot of projection from you…

        • Phydeau says:

          As Gomer Pyle would say: surprise, surprise, surprise.

          Former Speaker Newt Gingrich (R-Ga.) said in a new interview that Donald Trump has taken a different tone as president-elect and may be leaving behind his campaign promise to “drain the swamp.”

          Gingrich told NPR’s “Morning Edition” that he was told Trump “now says [the phrase] was cute, but he doesn’t want to use it anymore.”

          Translation: he said what he had to say to con the rubes, and now that he’s succeeded, he’s got no more use for it.

          As one of my favorite liberal trolls said: “How’s that drainy-swampy thingy workin’ out for ya, Trumpcucks?”

          I know NFS will come up with something to defend Trump. He always does. How about you, plusminus? Got any balls? Gonna defend your guy? 🙄 🙄 Hmeyers? More tortured logic about how Trump getting elected is a good thing? Let’s hear it, wingnuts. 🙂

          (Trumpcucks, heh. 😀 )

          • NewFormatSux says:

            In your post below, you demonstrate draining the swamp.

            “appointed the CEO of Exxon-Mobil as Secretary of State, or that Oklahoma guy who hates the EPA to run the EPA, or that billionaire who hates public education to run the dept of education”

  10. NewFormatSux says:

    >the billionaires, plutocrats, Republican Fat Cats and Wall Street Insiders that Trump has appointed to run the government. Thanks to you idjits who were conned by his line of BS.

    vs the billionaires, plutocrats, Democratic Fat Cats and Wall Street Insiders that Clinton would have appointed to run the government. So what’s the con? Trump showed up to campaign, while Hillary spent more money in Omaha than Wisconsin and Michigan COMBINED, presumably to please Warren Buffett.

    • Phydeau says:

      Clinton is the reasonable Republican, Trump is the wacked-out one. Clinton wouldn’t have appointed the CEO of Exxon-Mobil as Secretary of State, or that Oklahoma guy who hates the EPA to run the EPA, or that billionaire who hates public education to run the dept of education, or that crazy Gen. Flynn to any post.

      • NewFormatSux says:

        Yes, a reasonable Republican generally engages in a losing strategy, just like Clinton. That’s why they rolled the dice with Trump. You voted for Clinton, are you happy with spending more money to flatter Warren Buffett than Wisconsin and Michigan combined?

  11. bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

    Trump will PROVE to be a disaster to the 99%’ers BECAUSE he is NOT ABOUT GOVERNING….. but rather about “other issues’ LIKE stroking his own ego or having his name on more buildings or having a pair of lips on his asshole. How many of YOU are UP for THAT????????????? ………… Don’t be SHY……… purse your lips so we know who is Trump Stupid.

    Ha, ha………..his signature accomplishment to date: bribing International AllReadyTooRich Multi-Nationals to keep 30% of their workforce for one product in the USA. THE WORST DEAL THAT COULD HAVE EVER BEEN MADE.

    Even if the LIES were TRUE—you Trump Idiot would still be: just that. More Vooddoo Economics a la Reagan. You idiots never learn a thing.

    • NewFormatSux says:

      You seem to be going thru the stages of grief in reverse.

    • ± says:

      Holy crap bobbo, didju buy ECAs old stuck CAPSLOCK key keyboard?

      [parting inanity left unsaid]

  12. NewFormatSux says:

    > how fast, how often do you have to lower your appreciation of “winning” to say there is “any” for the Midwest?

    “I have more useless scraps than you do. I win.”

    HMeyers, care to donate some money? I think I’ll try and get bobbo’s comments running on TV in 2020 in the Midwest.

    • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

      NFS==well done. I appreciate the appeal to special interest groups as somehow what is: “best for America.”

      You got to get stupid……… if you want to appeal to stupid. Its why “theoretically” democracy can never work……… course…… there are other issues at play OTHER THAN the stupid self interest of economic factions out of synch with the rest of the world. IE: as the world gets smaller and flattens out …….. we have a race to the bottom that no American can win if the TrumpOcrats are allowed to move capital around to the most craven of political entities rather than actually leverage the POWER of governmental contracting to bring the Corporate Elite to heel.

      Suck to be you……….. which is me as well. ……….. Just plain sucks.

  13. NewFormatSux says:

    Marc Perkel’s OTHER preferred presidential candidate was behind the fake news that Republican electors were going to abandon Trump, leading Hillary electors to abandon her.

  14. bobbo, seeing reality thru the fog of political propaganda and the Media Stoogefest says:

    Scraps? Just political bribery to fool the gullible public. You actually KNOW this… its just easier to ignore it while you post otherwise. thats one major problem in America: everyone studiously ignorning what they actually know.

    ………….. ummmm ….. you DO know the truth of it all?…. Ha, ha….. make that Rhetorical … as …. I don’t want to know otherwise.

  15. Phydeau says:

    Ah, now this explains a lot about why wingnuts swoon over Putin. Racists around the world swoon over him! 🙄 🙄

    Throughout the presidential campaign, Donald J. Trump mystified many on the left and in the foreign policy establishment with his praise for Mr. Putin and his criticism of the Obama administration’s efforts to isolate and punish Russia for its actions in Crimea and eastern Ukraine. But what seemed inexplicable when Mr. Trump first expressed his admiration for the Russian leader seems, in retrospect, to have been a shrewd dog whistle to a small but highly motivated part of his base.

    For Mr. Heimbach is far from alone in his esteem for Mr. Putin. Throughout the collection of white ethnocentrists, nationalists, populists and neo-Nazis that has taken root on both sides of the Atlantic, Mr. Putin is widely revered as a kind of white knight: a symbol of strength, racial purity and traditional Christian values in a world under threat from Islam, immigrants and rootless cosmopolitan elites.

    “I’ve always seen Russia as the guardian at the gate, as the easternmost outpost of our people,” said Sam Dickson, a white supremacist and former Ku Klux Klan lawyer who frequently speaks at gatherings of the so-called alt-right, a far-right fringe movement that embraces white nationalism and a range of racist and anti-immigrant positions. “They are our barrier to the Oriental invasion of our homeland and the great protector of Christendom. I admire the Russian people. They are the strongest white people on earth.

    • NewFormatSux says:

      I always suspected Marc Perkel was a neo-Nazi KKK guy. Just look at Elon Musk and Hillary Clinton.

    • ± says:

      Stating my position again:

      The best thing about the last election is that Clinton lost. The worst thing about it is that D/R governance was re-installed, particularly with Trump at the helm. We are truly doomed in the long term.

      That said, I think you read too much into Trump supporters re Putin. Putin isn’t pusillanimous like Obama is. It hurt to be American with our pussy-in-chief constantly apologizing to everyone for us. The perception is that Trump is not a pussy is refreshing and a vote-attractor from the hoi polloi.

      I don’t have a good explanation why people would vote for a known felon, traitor and liar. At least at this point Trump only shares the liar trait with Clinton, and/but he’s not even president yet.

      • NewFormatSux says:

        >I don’t have a good explanation why people would vote for a known felon, traitor and liar.

        Because the wine and steaks were fake.

        • ± says:

          Ah yes. You must be referring to this scene from the Matrix series:

          The salient line is “ignorance is bliss”. A fundament of R/D governance and descriptive of everyone who helped to re-install D/R governance. You all ate the blue pill.

      • Hmeyers says:

        Both the parties sucks.

        Especially now.

        There is supposed to be a fucking difference between the Republican and Democratic parties …

        Hillary loved the corporate trough and was pro-MegaCorp in way that would put Jeb Bush to shame.

        When in doubt, kick the one in power out.

        At least if you do that, the cronies change and partially undo the shit the cronies of the other party did.

        The new party in power will screw it up eventually, it has been proven time and time again.

        But at least rotating them gives people a fighting chance.

        There is no telling what level of damage “The Queen” would have wrought, but it would have been very bad.

        Trump will start out on a bit shakey ground and he loves the polls.

        Well, he’s at about 50 percent approval rating.

        For someone as vain as Trump, he’s gotta do a lot of things right and very few things wrong to obtain the “love of the people” that he so craves.

        • NewFormatSux says:

          >When in doubt, kick the one in power out.

          HMeyers, that is what bobbo says when there is no election ongoing, only without the doubt. Then at election time he declares vote Dem.

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            Thats a fair enough review…..its the trap when everyone running IS an incumbent which doesn’t apply to Trump as he indeed would be the candidate of choice according to an excellent baseline approach: “VOTE THE INCUMBENT OUT OF OFFICE….. and don’t let them back in.”

            I don’t eventually vote Dumbo all the time because I’m a Dumbocrap….I eventually vote dumbo all the time (when I do) because they usually have the least offensive candidate…. EVEN WHEN including the Third Party candidates===>which Trump pragmatically is.

            Sheeples like Post Menopausal who don’t think outside of easy to hang labels do not understand the contesting venerables.

            At a more insightful level, incumbents have a “track record” that can be checked against their promises…. and most of them come up short, hence “VOTE ALL INCUMBENTS OUT OF OFFICE….. as they are lying sacks of shit only wanting your vote so they can continue to get rich off Corporate contributions.” The thing with Trump though is that he has a very long and detailed public record of lying as a sack of shit does. So…. the easy rule to follow doesn’t work as effectively we have 3 incumbents running for office…with Jill Stein as the only non-incumbent candidate. Could voting for someone with less than 1% support be any more stupid?

            I mean, that would be SO STUPID….. as to be recommended by Post Menopausal.

            Ha, ha…… voting Dem in California or Jill Stein anwhere is: “a waste of time.”

            Just like most of politics…………… just keeping my powder (IE–my vote) dry. Is there another Bernie in the weeds?

      • Phydeau says:

        I don’t have a good explanation why people would vote for a known felon, traitor and liar.

        Whatta maroon. Trump paid $25 million in the Trump University case. Guilty. He’s been sued hundreds if not thousands of times by small businessmen he stiffed. Liar. And played footsie with the Russians, who helped him get elected. Traitor.

        So why did you vote for a known, felon, traitor, and liar, plusminus? I’m all ears. 🙄 🙄 🙄

        • ± says:

          You don’t pay attention very well. I always vote but I haven’t voted R/D since 1990. I’m not part of the electorate destroying the nation like you are.

          I would cut my left hand off before I ever tried to hire another D/R.

          • Phydeau says:

            Duly noted. And yet, I see you following the BS fictional wingnut script about Clinton (felon, traitor, etc.), and strangely silent about Trump’s shortcomings. You’ve got Clinton insanity, which automatically puts you in league with the Trumpbots.

          • ± says:

            Sheesh. It’s a fucking travesty that Trump is president of the USA. I guess the only thing that would make you happy is if I had joined you in voting for a traitor, felon, liar. You fucking R/D zealots are all the same.

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            “….♫… Everybody knows………..”
            a vote for a third party,
            EFFECTIVELY…. was a vote for Trump.

            Must be some kind of fixation not tho have figured that out in some 30 years.

            do you prefer whips…. or chains?

          • ± says:

            [to bobbo]
            Here we go again. You probably won’t get it this time either.
            Voting third party has a slight possibility of bringing about a real positive change and it can’t possibility do more damage than the electorate already does by hiring D/Rs.
            If everyone does what I do, a positive change may occur, if everyone continues to does what you do, the USA will continue on its way to ultimate failure.
            This is basic logic which you haven’t grasped in the past. Why go there again? BTW, didju register yet?

            [pseudo pithy riposte avoided here]

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            Post Menopausal, never off the rag says:
            12/22/2016 at 12:39 pm

            [to bobbo]
            Here we go again. You probably won’t get it this time either. /// Reality Check: how many people vote TP? Not that the wisdom of crowds is always correct…. but you can’t ignore it as if being a crackpot wingnut ab initio did not need to be suspected…….

            Voting third party has a slight possibility of bringing about a real positive change /// only balanced by the VERY LARGE POSSIBILITY of being the WORST CHOICE of those running. I mean: give me a break: Gary Johnson?===>Pulease….. the more that was ever published on his moronic support of libertarian principles (eg: all children should be home schooled) the WORSE he looked. Actually….about as bad as all the Republicans, being outshined by all the Dumbos running. I know it sucks to be you, but thats how the cracker crumbles.

            and it can’t possibility do more damage than the electorate already does by hiring D/Rs. /// Simple wrong if any of the candidates would actually “do” what they claim they would do while running. BIGGEST exception: Ralph Nader. I’d love to have seen his Presidency….but he never got high enough in the polls to EFFECTIVELY VOTE FOR BUSH by voting for Nader. Seems like you can’t understand a chain of causation beyond being kicked in the nuts.

            If everyone does what I do, a positive change may occur, if everyone continues to does what you do, the USA will continue on its way to ultimate failure. /// “If”===then “may” followed by a guess. You got some powerful analysis there Post Menopausal.

            This is basic logic which you haven’t grasped in the past. /// Logic??? You mean your sillygism totally isolated from what your TP candidates said? Ha, ha.

            Why go there again? BTW, didju register yet? // No. I couldn’t stand the traffic.

            [pseudo pithy riposte avoided here] /// Actually…. always avoided in your entire post….. but thats a given.

          • NewFormatSux says:

            Bobbo, thinking with words, declares
            Voting third party is a vote for Trump

            Then why did all the NeverTrumpers vote third party? And why did all the Trump supporters get mad at them for doing so?

  16. Hmeyers says:


    East religions teach that enlightenment comes from being objective and detaching from emotion.

    You get all wound up about “Trump”. Like he’s the center of your universe or something.

    It is because of this, …

    That you can’t find spiritual enlightment.

    And also why you aren’t a true seeker of knowledge.

    Emotion and bias aren’t a source of strength, they are a heavy burden someone has to carry around.

    Would you actually be happy if Hillary had won? You seem to carry too many chips to know what it would be like to experience “happy”.

    Perhaps you live in a state where they legalized marijuana. Although I’m not in favor of drugs (nor particularly against them, should be a personal choice) — perhaps you need to experience some recreational use of marijuana to help you mellow out and enjoy life?

    Otherwise, you may end up experiencing a mental breakdown.

    • Phydeau says:

      Thanks for sharing, Hmeyers. You are apparently just fine with Trump appointing billionaires, Republican fat cats, and Wall Street insiders to run the country. And changing his mind on that whole “drain the swamp” thing. Good for you. Glad to know where you stand.

      • Mickey Goldmill says:

        FYI, you’ve repeated the phrase “fat cats” 7 times in this thread.

        You’re punch drunk, kid. Throw in the towel. Lay down. Hit the showers.

        Ding, ding!

        • NewFormatSux says:

          It’s what dogs do.

        • Phydeau says:

          It happens to be true, Mickey. Kinda hurts when the other side does it, huh? Thought the things y’all have been endlessly repeating about Obama, Clinton, and other Democrats (Benghazi Benghazi Benghazi!) fall in the realm of FoxNews/FakeNews.

          Beat it, Mickey. Shoo.

        • NewFormatSux says:

          With Trump, you’re gonna eat lightning and crap thunder.

    • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

      HM: you really are CONFLATING the notion of enlightenment with happiness……all in the context of participating in a forum OP addressing Politics… leading to Trump…. and any sane, informed, DARE I say enlightened understanding of the threat he presents to America?

      There is NO “happiness” in american politics. Just an attempt at weeding out the most noxious weeds………..>>>starting with criminal BS psychopathic Billionaires who have too many cutting their own throats by thinking tax cuts for the AllReadyTooRich is somehow going to bring jobs back to America?

      Ha, ha…………. you got the wrong end of a very dirty stick.

      • Hmeyers says:

        Might be a bit of a tangent …

        But here is how an agnostic is different from an atheist …

        I enjoy reading Eastern philosophy and studying Eastern religions and beliefs.

        Somewhat similar to an atheist, I don’t put much stock in what any particular religion has to say about the inner mysteries of life.

        But unlike an atheist, I am interested in their philosophical viewpoints because life is one of those things where everyone has different perspectives.

        I think the Achilles heal of atheism is “certainty” — overrates human intelligence and pride is known to be a human weakness — and the nihilism that comes from “believing in nothing”.

        Atheism isn’t open minded. Atheism wouldn’t believe in the concept of spirituality.

        Because as an agnostic, the door is never quite open nor quite shut — like Schrodinger’s Cat is neither alive nor dead — and you have no sense of closure because you understand it is rather unlikely that you will ever really know the answers to any mysteries.

        The presidential election is a bit of an entertainment sideshow. And an opportunity for introspection of our political system.

        Does it really matter in the scheme of things? Nah.

        • Phydeau says:

          In the long run, in the great scheme of things, we’ll all be dead. But until we’re dead, or at least for the next four years, we’re going to have a difficult time in the US and probably in the world, because misguided people like you and ignernt wingnuts like NFS, Diesel, and the like, have gotten a corrupt, narcissistic, immature man-child elected president. Thanks. 🙄

        • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

          Agnosticism: not having the intellectual honesty to form a working hypothesis.

          You are even more wrong on the BASIC definitions/qualities of all the other terms you use as well…..quite consistent with a failure of intellectual “rigor.”

          FORM–an idea. TEST it against the real world. DO NOT wallow in a sea of self delusional ambiguity.

          Do elections matter? OF COURSE THEY DO. The fact that you/we can’t predict the exact repercussions doesn’t make what does happen most important, and backing up a bit perhaps more perspicaciously==>what was more likely to occur.

          Do you like having health insurance? That would be a Hillary.

          Do you like, or would you like a regulated financial fraud industry? That would be a Hillary.

          ………………. and so forth.

          The moral equivalency argument is always a fraud.

          • Hmeyers says:

            You need to read Decartes and some of the other philosophers like Kant.

            Your strong opinions on this subject arise on not from knowledge and education …

            … but from a lack of it 🙂

          • Hmeyers says:

            Bobbo, I leave you with something to ponder …

            You don’t see much about Big Bang in the news for the last couple of years.

            I once thought the Big Bang was up there with evolution as something certifiably true.

            But all the recent news is bad news, and they keep discovering ancient galaxies 13 billion light years away.

            And stars and galaxies beyond what is supposed to be the distance limit.

            And stellar objects that shouldn’t exist today, but finding them nearby.

            And stellar objects that must exist according to the Big Bang, they aren’t finding them at all (Population III stars).

            And sensitive detectors that must detect certain phenoma required by the Big Bang are finding nothing at all. Dark matter? No. Dark energy? No. Graviton waves? Not only not found, but found to not exist in the required thresholds.

            5 years ago, I would have swore the Big Bang was true.

            I expect within the next 10 years, the Big Bang to be disproved after they launch a new generation of highly powerful space telescopes.

            If the Big Bang turns out to be wrong, what else — that we lowly humans are so damn certain of — might we be wrong about?

          • NewFormatSux says:

            Bobbo says, “FORM–an idea. TEST it against the real world. DO NOT wallow in a sea of self delusional ambiguity.”

            Anyone else laughing?

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            HM: I’d challenge you to provide just what “rendition” of the Big Bang theory you are talking/thinking about. It can be very general, or quite specific. If graviton waves are gravity waves….those were detected a few months ago.

            Your position is a poor one though: “We don’t know EVERYTHING IN DETAIL RIGHT NOW…. so let’s throw out the best theory we have so far.”

            In favor of what alternative theory HM?
            …. and thats what I’ll leave you with….. along with the recommendation to have the best Egg Nog you have the patience to make around this time of year.

            I like it fresh from scratch and just whisking the eggs initally to make the drink as foamy as that will get it. The effort to foam the whites then fold them back in is just not worth any taste difference to me…… but your taste/values may vary.

            Thats just how liberal I am.

            Merry X-mas.

          • Hmeyers says:

            Bobbo, have a Happy Holidays or Merry X-Mas! 🙂

            (Regarding the Big Bang, which at some point would be interesting to discuss with you further, to protect the theory some scientists are now advancing the “a variable speed of light” to explain inconsistencies.


            I’m not suggesting a variable speed of light is right or wrong, I personally believe we do not understand the speed of light over long distances and we don’t have a way to evaluate such a thing— i.e. we cannot conduct intergalactic distance tests.

            But the real problem for the Big Bang is that if the speed of light isn’t a constant, then the previously dismissed Steady State Theory comes back into play.

            Ironically, if some form of Steady State — the universe is very, very old or even infinitely old — ends being relevant again, it will both piss off Christians and many Atheists.

            The Big Bang in many ways is a “Creationist” Theory, which is why the current Pope likes it. And many atheists love Big Bang Theory most from the perspective of an alternate non-religious explanation of the universe.

            If the truth lies elsewhere, both sides will be very disappointed.

            Like how both the Bushes and Clintons aren’t very happy with the election season.)

          • Hmeyers says:

            And Bobbo — enjoy your eggnogs. 🙂

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            X-Mas Merry Holidays Morning…. too early for egg nog…. Irish Cappuccino will have to do.

            Big Bang Theory: the Universe came into existence some 14 Billion years ago from a tiny spot/point. This cannot be denied from the evidence we see today: everything expanding from what would be a common point.

            Every other issue you name such as the speed of light is NOT the Big Bang Theory.

            HM: you may not count yourself a Republican: but you think like one: “Everything is related to something else.” …… and while thats true in a very philosophical mostly unhelpful way…. thinking more in subject related contexts might provide more rigor to your thinking than currently demonstrated…. like more yolks in the nog… although I find no benefit over using whole eggs…… but I don’t blame that on the Big Bang Theory.

            “….♫… All we need is a little patience…”

  17. Phydeau says:

    Slime alert #4,325

    On Thursday, the Wall Street Journal reported that Trump’s pick to run the Health and Human Services Department, Georgia Republican, Rep. Tom Price, “traded more than $300,000 in shares of health-related companies over the past four years while sponsoring and advocating legislation that potentially could affect those companies’ stocks.”

    In a normal world, an influential congressman trading stocks around laws he was helping write that would deeply impact those stocks would be a fireable offense. But now, let’s make him Secretary of HHS!

    Get ready for epic levels of corruption in the Trump administration.

    So how’s that swampy-drainy thingy working out for you, Trumpcucks? 😉

    • Phydeau says:

      Hey Mickey, do you think Price qualifies as a “fat cat” or just another run-of-the-mill corrupt Republican politician? 😀

      • Mickey Goldmill says:

        Just can’t stay down on the canvas, eh?

        Ok, get it out of your system kid. Then let Adrian put a steak over your puffy eyes.

        Ding, ding, ding.

        • Phydeau says:

          Pedrito? Is that you? Your content-free posts give you away… 😉

          • ± says:

            [changing the subject yet still addressing this post and many others of yours]

            Do you think think your inane and unconnected smileys mitigate being responsible for vapid posts? Never mind; I know the answer.


    • NewFormatSux says:

      That’s awfully weak on details. About $8k per stock. Over four years. We also don’t know if this was a unique purchase, or just a small part of his investments. For example, if he invested a week before he introduced a bill, that would be quite different from he is buying and selling lots of stocks, or perhaps an index fund. Or perhaps he just needed the money.

      I mentioned the detail above, because Tereza Heinz Kerry had some curious stock investments a week before some Congressional action. Didn’t stop Kerry from becoming Secretary of State.

      SEC turns a blind eye to actions by members of Congress that would get others thrown in jail.

  18. Phydeau says:

    OMG and WTF!

    “A tense new battle over nuclear arms erupts between…”

    The US and some foreign power? No!

    “… between Donald Trump and his staff

    We’re going to see a lot of this. Trump tweets from the hip, in an impulsive reaction to some world event, and several of his staff members have to wade in and clean up the mess. We saw it with the China/Taiwan debacle, and now this:

    It began, it seems, with a speech from Vladimir Putin on Thursday, during which the Russian president argued that his country’s nuclear arsenal needed to be upgraded. In short order a tense two-day stand-off began — between Donald Trump and the communications staffers on his transition team.

    Trump’s initial comment about nuclear proliferation was clear in its intent if vague in its boundaries.

    The United States must greatly strengthen and expand its nuclear capability until such time as the world comes to its senses regarding nukes

    “The United States must greatly strengthen and expand its nuclear capability” is not subtle, implying that as president Trump aims to match whatever it is that Russia does. That, as we pointed out on Thursday, means a new nuclear arms race, contravening decades of American foreign policy.

    Great! Another nuclear arms race! Because it was so much fun before! 🙄 🙄

    But then his staffers start the cleanup process, say he didn’t really mean it, blah blah blah, never mind what he said, he clearly said this but he really meant that, blah blah blah.

    It’s gonna be a long four years. 🙁

    • NewFormatSux says:

      What is this Taiwan China issue that Trump messed up?
      Could you explain how taking a phone call from the President of Taiwan is more of a problem from the Chinese perspective than say… selling weapons to Taiwan?

  19. Phydeau says:

    And this doesn’t even cover the stupidity of his tweet:

    The United States must greatly strengthen and expand its nuclear capability until such time as the world comes to its senses regarding nukes

    Because nothing is going to make other nations “come to their senses” and get rid of their nukes faster than seeing the US add more nukes to its arsenal. 🙄 🙄 🙄

    Can this guy really be that stupid???

    • NewFormatSux says:

      You are not much for history I take it.

      • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

        Pretty much, I think Phydeaux and all other non-saber (ie: that would be Nukes for those of you who can notice any relevant issue) rattling forgetters of History if they ever knew it in the first place: is actually hoping for HISTORY……………. to continue.

        ……… you know, as opposed to stopping.

  20. Phydeau says:

    Aw, I’ll stop for a while. I know you guys didn’t vote for Trump because of his astute knowledge of foreign policy or the economy or knowledge of anything, actually. You didn’t vote for him because he impressed you with his sober mind, high moral values (hah!) or ethical views. You voted for him because he made you feel good. He said just enough for you to fill in the blanks and project what you wanted to believe on him. Salesmen are good at that.

    For me to point out that he’s an immature, selfish, narcissistic, resentful, petty man-child is beside the point, to you. It would be like if a woman buys a sexy pair of FMPs and I point out that they’re going to be uncomfortable to wear. That’s not the point. The point is to feel good, and Trump made you feel good, at least enough to close the sale. Now, he doesn’t give a sh*t about you, because you already bought it. Oh well. But you did get to feel good for a little while. I hope four years of incompetence, corruption, and financial disaster is worth it for you.

    • Hmeyers says:

      Phydeau, have a Merry Christmas or a Happy Holidays!

      You might consider more the “recreational marijuana” thing if you need to loosen up a bit 🙂 I myself am not into such, but I do enjoy the alcohol beverages this time of year 🙂

      But anyways, even though I don’t fully agree with you on some thing, enjoy the weekend and New Years! 🙂

      • Phydeau says:

        Thanks Hmeyers, you too, Merry Christmas and Happy Assorted Other Holidays Involving the Solstice! 😀

        • Hmeyers says:

          I’m halfway into getting plastered, likewise I hope you are enjoying yourself, Phydeau 🙂

          Holiday cheers! 🙂

    • NewFormatSux says:

      Well the stock market seems to be doing well so far, and economic confidence levels are way up.

  21. bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

    Testing: is my Browser broken, or is it this Website?

    ………………..checking for………………..

    ……………………………………………………….. signs of life.


  22. bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

    This blew my mind…..even though I’m proud I knew 10% of it already. Life………… Nature ……………. downright===>mystical.

    9 min video on the Four Major evolutionary advances life has made. More basic than I thought….but I’m on board with the explanation. All so fragile and intricate.

    I’m gonna drink to this.

    Good stuff in the side bar too if you haven’t stopped learnin’.

    • IM78 says:

      Wow! This is an awesome video. Thanks for sharing the link. Now I have a much better appreciation why you and those like you have such a hard time with the concept of a creator being.

      • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

        Ha,ha…….IM===>I don’t have a hard time dismissing Fairytale Sky Gods….. its easy. Just pretend you need a shred of evidence or logic before you start believing ……….. “anything.”

        Try it.

        Next lesson: note the “anti” theist. EVEN IF GOD DID EXIST…. as however imagined: I still reject the concept. Such a God would simply be a more powerful “other” entity. NOTHING to “worship.” Thinking hominoids don’t do that.

        You can blame/think God or Darwin.

        • IM78 says:

          “Ha,ha…….IM===>I don’t have a hard time dismissing Fairytale Sky Gods….. its easy.”

          Oh, I know.

          “Just pretend you need a shred of evidence or logic before you start believing ……….. “anything.”

          Try it.”

          I did. That was when I was about six years old.

          “Next lesson: note the “anti” theist. EVEN IF GOD DID EXIST…. as however imagined: I still reject the concept. Such a God would simply be a more powerful “other” entity. NOTHING to “worship.” Thinking hominoids don’t do that.”

          Especially thinking hominids, such as yourself, that suffer from an over inflated ego.

          “You can blame/think God or Darwin.”

          I don’t blame God for anything, but I do give Him thanks for including me among those that He’s given extraordinary understanding.

          As for Mr Darwin … another extremely intelligent fellow such as yourself. He too was hindered by an overactive ego.

          Some day if I sense you’re up to it, I’ll explain enough about reality to you in order to jump-start the next stage of your education.

          • bobbo, we think with words and flower with ideas says:

            As you will IM.

            One of my favorites: “If you could reason with the religious, they wouldn’t be religious to begin with.”

            ……….and sure to come up: how come you reject all those other religions….. who talk, believe on the same basis with the same certainty as you do?

            So…..go ahead and enjoy “thanking” God for whatever…. THAT is not even the issue. The issue for everyone else is why can’t you keep your god to yourself? By belief: he doesn’t need your help…………oops……I see I’m on a long slide here.

            I’ll stop.


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