Make up your minds!
Study of Greenland Ice Finds Rapid Change in Past Climate – NYTimes.com — More research that will be rejected in favor of the “man caused it” theories. The NY Times seems to have switched sides, though, so that could make a difference.
The scientists said their data showed that significantly warmer periods and significantly colder periods had occurred during the last interval between glacial epochs, about 115,000 to 135,000 years ago. They said they could not tell whether that meant similar changes were in store. Their findings were reported today in two papers in the journal Nature.
Previous studies had shown that there were abrupt changes in climate during glacial epochs, but the new results show that the same was true in the periods when glaciers had retreated. In one “catastrophic event” during the last interglacial period, the average temperature plunged 25 degrees Fahrenheit to ice-age levels for about 70 years, the scientists reported.
The authors said they did not have an explanation for the rapid shifts. They also said it was a mystery why the climate of the last 8,000 to 10,000 years had been “strangely stable.”
related link: Global Cooling predicted in the 1970’s
Obamaforever,
Don’t worry about pedro. He likes goats, not mules.
Mr Confusion, North was asked about the Wegman Report, and he said he agreed with the findings on methodology, which was the area of overlap between the two reports.
That North found current temperatures to be the highest of the last 400 years is not surprising, and doesn’t contradict Wegman’s findings that the methods used by Mann to make his hockey stick are flawed. Wegman stated:ANSWER CORRECT plus METHOD WRONG equals BAD SCIENCE
For that matter, the highest temperatures of the last 400 years is an irrelevant point, since the issue with the hockey stick, and its use in the IPCC report, was as a bludgeon to explain how sure they are about their main findings, that temperatures have never been this warm in the past.
The Medieval Warm Period was 1000 years ago, and there aren’t many people who take issue that current temperatures are warmer than at any point in the past 400 years.
North’s panel gave a lower probability to the idea that temperatures are the highest in the last 1000-2000 years, merely calling it plausible. He also told the media that they didn’t do a detailed analysis of the various studies that confirmed the hockey stick, saying ‘we just kinda winged it’
Mr Confusion, reading the link you posted, you quoted:
Gerald North, …, stated the politicians at the hearing at which the Wegman report was presented “were twisting the scientific information for their own propaganda purposes. The hearing was not an information gathering operation, but rather a spin machine.”
…
The sentences right after that, which you failed to post is:
In testimony when asked if he disputed the methodology conclusions of Wegman’s report, he stated that “No, we don’t. We don’t disagree with their criticism. In fact, pretty much the same thing is said in our report. But again, just because the claims are made, doesn’t mean they are false.”
Perhaps you got confused by all those “don’t”s
I admittedly am not sure what that last line is referring to.
Over such a long time-scale, those communities would have time to adapt defences and or relocate to higher ground, or even relocate to another country. This is a trivial problem compared to crippling and terminal oil shortages within the next 5 years. This is why we need to begin building more coal fired power stations now, without CCS. Electric vehicles can help us deal with peak oil. CO2 is not the problem.
Mr fusion, heres the “trick” as illustrated by tour posted response…
“The result of fixing some of the alleged errors in the overall reconstruction does not change the general shape of the most recent part of the reconstruction.”
Exactly as I and everyone with a brain can see, that if you lop off the first half of the graph…. ie the medieval period…. the part they hid from YOU through faked data (yes it was faked.. estimated and interpolated when it didn’t have to be)… the hockey stick remains. Well Duh. Just like they stop the graph at 2000 so that the temperature drops don’t show. Do you like being duped like that. I remember ‘disingenuous’ was a word you liked to use, and the hockey stick graph is just that.
MikeN has it right.
Mr fusion, here’s a transcript of Honorable Mr. Bart Stupak in Connection with Testimony to the Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations putting a series of questions to Dr. Wegman following the Congressional hearings into the hockey stick in July 2006. The questions and his answers deal with a lot of the purported refutations. His response is here. (10MB file)
!! crapyp html allowed in posting… Response here
http://www.uoguelph.ca/~rmckitri/research/StupakResponse.pdf
Cripes. Just copy and paste please.
Look you yahoo’s, all this stuff is one HUGE disinfo campaign to make sure nobody ever actually learns the truth about *ANYTHING*
PERIOD.
How many times must a politician or government funded scientist or “body of science” look you in the eye and lie to your face, -repeatedly, -before you people get it??
All the *empirical* proof for “climate-gate” is in the program code they used to make their pretty climate charts-n-graphs with.
Do you hear anyone in MSM screaming “look at the code, look at the code!!”??
No.
Because the PTB is controlling both sides of the argument. Nobody in the mainstream will tell you anything worth a hill of beans. They will throw you a kernel of truth firmly ensconced in a fat pack of lies to keep you busy. Their only objective is to cast even more doubt on whatever subject needs “doubting” so you will be forever caught in arguments that lead NOWHERE.
If someone gets a wild hair up their butt and stops “going with the program” or your tiny little attention spans need to be pulled away a possible truth bubbling up, a sex scandal will magically appear out of nowhere. [surprise]
-now..one more time.
Its an Electric Universe (filled with plasma)
We have Electric Weather and large [electric] comets, more often than not, cause sudden shifts in planetary weather..
The rest of the shifts are due to regularly scheduled events like pole flips and such. And the flips are not 180 degrees, just a “lazy” 30 degrees. (why do you think they find palm trees and the like the poles?) Its all in the historical record (just not in the one we have been taught)
-and there is more fun stuff on the way..
Seek and ye shall find.
See? all nice and tidy.
-you may now resume your petty bickering.
-s
Soundwash… gotta love ya man. 🙂
“Look – things changed rapidly in the past so we aren’t the ones causing the change!” What a dumb and illogical argument.
Yep, some predicted global cooling in the past but it was no where near the consensus we have now nor was the data as abundant as it was now. Nor do we have any real scientific evidence showing this is all hogwash now, just some yahoos, the vast majority of which have direct ties to industries with interest in stymying (sp?) any change which could affect their bottom line. Show me 100 industry independent climate scientists and I’ll show you a consensus we have global warming now and it’s very likely we are vastly influencing that warming if not out right causing it.
JimR,
You like to post articles that don’t say anything. So here, read this one. It exposes the Myths of McIntyre and McKirick.
But I know you won’t even click on the link. You think a rock hound and economist know better than three climatologists writing about climatology.
JimR
Then there is the Wikipedia write up on the “hockey stick”. But you won’t read that either because it might not validate your attempted fraud.
Or you could visit Real Climate, an online journal for climate scientists.
94 Hyph3n. Yes, CO^2 may have a role to play. Soot from China may have a role. Observed historical temperature swings may have a role. My Aunt’s fanny may have a role too.
Hopefully we’ll all at least get some amusement factor out of the multi-billions of tax $ that superstitious, money-grubbing politicians and “scientists” are so willing to prematurely place in their pockets even in the face of contrary evidence and all the alternatives that don’t involve a liberal social agenda.
Again, all my provided text quotes, summaries and references were included with immediate and explicit source links as a service I provide for humanity in the name of short attention spans. It must be especially confusing for you when references such as Wikipedia place all their sources lumped together at the bottom.
RBG
From: Obamaforever
To: All anti-Climate Change Retards
Thank you Mr. Fusion for your information.
Your information directed me to the realclimate site.
I suggest you Retards go to realclimate.org. This site will give you the straight dope on McIntyre and McKirick (MM).
What MM like to do is muddy the waters. And thus the true climate scientists have to spend valuable time clearing-up the waters.
For the climate scientists MM are like a five pound hemorrhoid-a real pain in the ass, not necessary and damn glad when it is gone.
pedro, you are a 10 pound hemorrhoid on this site.
If you Retards want to know what MM are really up to just follow the money!!!
#106 -Thanks mate.
It is still perplexing that no matter how much you show people how simple it is to educate ones self to the truth, They choose to embrace the fantasy as if their life depended on it.
#107 – I also, was once amongst the “misinformed”
I see no reason why, if an “uneducated” person such as myself can discover and learn the truth as well what are the real factors involved that drives our climate, -why others cannot do the same.
Perhaps, i have too much faith in humanity.
Nonetheless, i do not think I will ever stop trying show people that life is simple. not complex, -and that you can teach yourself to learn the underlying fundamentals of anything you desire, including Life itself and more.
-you need only take the time to apply yourself and learn how to do your own research.
-s
rcrejects.wordpress.com has a small portion of the types of things that RealClimate censors from the eyes of their audience. They don’t like any serious challenges to their science.
When the e-mails were leaked, they allowed a bit more open dialogue, but that was it.
These are the same guys that supervise the Wikipedia pages on global warming.
William Connolley was so confident he setup a separate page defending RealCLimate from the charge of using the Tiljander proxy upside-down.
http://scienceblogs.com/stoat/2009/10/tiljander.php
A rigorous amateur showed him the errors made by the climate scientists. But hey I guess we should believe the climate scientists’ PHDs rather than our own eyes.
JimR, just leave out the www. and it will post.
MrConFusion is a bit low on the reading comprehension scale, so he might skim it, but don’t accept anything to get through.